 Poster: A snowHead
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sorry, but a carved turn is just that...start to finish. You use it where you want or can and it is a nice tool in the box in the right place,
But it's one reason why I have never subscribed to the carving at all costs idea, because in a huge percentage of skiers general turns it just ain't t so...
Don't like scarving or arcing either,
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Hurtle wrote: |
skimottaret,
1) (in all seriousness) should there be two columns of answers, one for Europe, one for North America? I have observed what seems to be something of a division of terminology between the two continents.
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Yikes, no. We need one set of terms, with one set of definitions. Compromises will have to be made, and it will be up to the pros to use terms according to the accepted vocabulary of this site, or get pointed to the Glossary. I've actually been self monitoring myself here at Snowheads where I can, in the interest of clarity.
Example: I know there's a discrepancy over what is the inside edge (inside according to the body, or inside according to the turn) so I've been using Big/little toe edge instead. I see the inside/outside edge terms have been included in the Glossary. My suggestion would be, in areas where discrepancies such as these exist, to do some kind of majority opinion rules thing, and that becomes the definition all go by when interacting on this site.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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By the way, skimottaret, just want to reiterate my thumbs up to this idea. I consider learning the language of skiing an important part of learning the sport. In learning what the terms mean, you begin to gain knowledge of the concepts behind them, and in the process get a better handle on the foundations of skiing. In my on-snow teaching, I consider helping people become aware of the basic terms and concepts of the sport a valuable supplement to teaching the skills. What an excellent resource this glossary will be for pursuing such an education.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Inside edge= inside ski for me.
FastMan, get the point about where do you start calling it carved, but I still don't like it. Even tho' pure would help, it is still doesn't sit right. I'd get off this obsession with carved turns personally but that just isn't going work either.
Overall a consensus of terms will help but some people are just going to have to reconcile that there are differences. It's called the english language so shouldn't be a huge problem 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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JT,
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Inside edge= inside ski for me.
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Surely you have two skis and both skis have an inside and an outside edge during a turn. 
PS is there any way of shrinking the picture above or giving it as a link it means the text goes off the edge of my screen making it difficult to follow.
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skimottaret, now see what you started? Isn't this just great. And the little pictures are awesome.
I suggest that we spin off discussions about the relative merits into their own threads?
Avalement the art of absorbing bumps using the legs so the that the body remains still and quiet. Reference turning on one bump thread. leading to "Avalement" turns where you use the swallowing (avaler, to swallow) of the bumps to assist pivoting.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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T Bar,
You can see at the time I posted that i was still asleep... I mean, inside edge of the driving ski..or inside ski is the inside ski of the turn
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[quote="David Murdoch"] the little pictures are awesome.
I suggest that we spin off discussions about the relative merits into their own threads?
quote]
agreed, Can we please at this point on this thread concentrate on getting all terms listed and a first pass definition done. We can then spin off individual threads on each term
Any more graphics that anyone has would be very useful.
I will try to add and update as people contribute
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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BANKING
A form of inclination where the outcome is less than desirable.
Banking is inclination without the skillful buildup of the angles, symptoms include a light, floating outside ski, and likelyhood of falling to the inside.
Inclination is linked to the "White Pass", banking is not 
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Thu 15-11-07 12:01; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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COUNTER
also referred to as "Counter Rotation", "Counter-Acting".
When you master separation, and are in the position where your skis are pointed across the hill, whilst your upper body is facing down the hill, you are then in a position known as “countered”. Various names exist for this, including “counter”, “counter-rotated”, “counter-acting”.
Note that countering, or counter-rotation, is not a deliberate move. It happens as a RESULT of you turning your skis under your body, with separation.
Note: "Counter-Acting" is almost exclusively used by PMTS, the other term in common usage there is "Counter-Balance" - and this is not the same thing as Counter, Counter Rotation. "Counter-Balance" is more akin to Angulation.
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???
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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PMTS
(I'll try to keep this as neutral as possible, and please, no slagging off here)
Primary Movements Teaching System (also known as DirectParallel TM)
A ski teaching system founded by Harald Harb (also referred to as HH) that is different to most other ski school systems in the world, founded on the premise of a new way of teaching to go along with the new shaped skis, as well as continually referencing high end skiing (eg: racing) as a model to aspire to.
One of the characteristics of this progression is that a snowplough or wedge is not taught in this system.
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Poster: A snowHead
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veeeight, how does counter differ from anticipation
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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David Murdoch, Yes. 
I have some good illustrative pictures which I'll post in time.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I see, sadly, that the terms regarding "weighting" are still being used - if nobody had ever used that very misleading and inappropriate term 80 odd years ago and had chosen to only refer to "pressuring" the skis (there are many ways to pressure the skis and dumping all your body weight on to one of them is possibly the most inefficient way)...if skiers stop thinking in terms of weight they will learn much mre quickly. I never ever use the term weight even with a beginner - I show them how to pressure their skis and we play around to see what results we get. The phrase" putting your weight on the outside ski" always sounded so finite and clumsy a thing to do. How many here are teachers ?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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krunchie63, good point and i will update the definition. but i have included some older terms and some that are more North American based for completeness.
There are probably 30 qualified teachers who post regularily here if i had to guess, but most of them are part timers who teach on the dry slopes or indoor snow domes (like me) with some good skiers who have gotten a qualification but dont actively teach. There are also many very good knowledgable expert level types that are backcountry or race skiers. Only a few full time mountain based pros contribute regularily.
easiski (LDA), veeeight (whistler), stewart woodward (tignes), and Martin Bell (the ex racer), Fastman (USA based race coach) to name a few.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Thanks skimottaret. You've already got plenty of great people who know what they are doing so if they can put it into writing I will leave them to it - but I will read what they say.
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DJ,
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I'm sorry, Hurtle, and I know it's off-topic, but I can't resist pointing out that fewer words would be needed
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Quite right. 
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I have tried to add all the terms i could think of, any other suggestions for words or phrases to add?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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skimottaret, how will this be managed? By question?
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David Murdoch, I was going to add any terms/phrases as they are suggested and then edit the first post from time to time as the individual items are discussed
How bout we use this thread to offer up new terms and phrases on an ongoing basis and start disecting the definitions in alphabtical order with:
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ANGULATION - bending your body so that your centre of mass is inside the turn and your edges are at and angle to the snow while remaining in balance.
Illustration: A skier in an angulated postion
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Any comments or is it okay?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Can we coin new words for things that don't have a fixed definition:
Anyone want to crack at SKURFING
(I suspect it does have an epic defn but lets not exclude the creative sort.)
& so the boarders don't feel Left out
"Vitelli Turn"
& for fun
"Schmear turn"
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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skimottaret, yup, like it.
Might add...
Angulation allows you to remain balanced while setting an edge (putting the ski on edge) - if you didn't angulate you'd topple over.
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fatbob, was going to leave the boarder stuff out as i dont have a clue about boarding terms perhaps another gloassary could be started in the Snowboard section... go for it...
I have started an alternative glossary thread and you should stick skurfing ther perhaps
I like schmear turn and OMG how did i forget my all time favourites the worm turn and the legendary jet turn.....
David Murdoch, done...
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You know it makes sense.
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skimottaret, how could you forget the Jet Turn?
And what about the slow dog noodle?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Skurfing - Deliberate tail pushing which would ordinarily be BAD but in powder or slushed up snow bank generates a surf-like feel. etymology - Skidding + surfing
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Poster: A snowHead
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Can someone help with the technicality of the web display here. Whenever I click to this thread it overflows the page with and I have to use the horizontal windows scroll to view the ends of the lines which is frustrating when elsewhere it all displays fine. Anyone got any ideas?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Megamum, it's because of the Ron LeMaster image that fastman used.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Sorry about that Megamum. Should I remove it? Or can someone tell me how to shrink it?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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FastMan, Either you or someone has played with that image - I am pleased to report that my display is back to normal - thanks to whoever fixed it. It's quite a nice set of photos actually.
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Schmear Turn - Turn which involves dropping your hip into the snow to use it like a (hand)brake. Needs a steep slope and deepish snow. Invented by Scott Schmidt, star of Blizzard of Aahs etc. Challenge is to find a video clip.
I can't do them 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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skimottaret, Brilliant thread. I don't have a lot of time to consider all the terms or add new ones at the moment, but would suggest for Angulation: Simply put, when there is an angle (laterally) between your legs and your upper body.
As an aside it seems to be one of the few words that is the same in every language that I've ever heard.
Uphill and Downhill? Seems self-evident to us, but it's staggering how many beginners don't seem to get it.
I like arc to arc - no mistaking what you mean there. As a digression on that subject I've recently had an enquiry from a new client who is nervous of steep and fast (found the ESF classes pushed her too hard), and thought she needed to learn carving!
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BUmp,
i have added quite a few terms, could everyone (or anyone?) have a go at defining one that still needs writing up...
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FAQ
). And in recreational skiing, it marks a difference between skill levels. We need to recognize carving, even when it's not done for the entire turn.
