| What's your preference: iPod or MiniDisc or .... other? |
| iPod |
|
54% |
[ 20 ] |
| MiniDisc |
|
10% |
[ 4 ] |
| MP3 |
|
29% |
[ 11 ] |
| Other |
|
5% |
[ 2 ] |
|
| Voted : 36 |
| Total Votes : 37 |
|
|
|
 Poster: A snowHead
|
hayley t, I think the iPod minis are dead cool (I'm getting a pink one for Daugther #2 for Xmas). Everyone's right that it's relatively small capacity these days, but that's not an issue if your tastes are relatively fixed or if you're going to refresh with new releases anyway. iPods beat everything else hands down for ease of update. Price is also an issue: if you know anyone going to the States, get them to bring one back for you.
You may be able to find another player that's rationally better value for money, but you won't love it as much!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
Cheers Dan and laundryman.
Id want enough tunes on it to last a holiday, long weekend and travelling etc, so a mini iPod would cover that I think. I'd want one that wouldn't date too easily and gives good enough sound quality to last a couple of years as I wouldn't want to keep splashing out on a new one regularly. Its not so much state of the art I want, its just to replace my cumbersome CD player. Although, battery life is an issue which is what prompted me to look at the Sony version.
laundryman, how much cheaper are they in the States?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
Have to say that I love my i-pod. Having all my cd's with me in the car is great. I use it at the gym, running and cycling. Dont think i will use on the slopes, prefer the peace and like to know if some mad speed skier is coming up behind me!
Will probably have it in the apartment though with some mini speakers.
Not sure if anyone answered the previous question but using i-tunes on a pc (rather than a mac) is just as easy.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
Just incase some people don't understand.......................an ipod is still an mp3 player, just Apples' version.
hayley t, just make sure you get one that supports mp3 & wma, and you'll want at least a couple of GB worth of memory. It may be worth going to a large Richer Sounds or music shop and listening to a few, picking them up and finding out what you want........then go buy it on ebay  Also if you can afford it (or have it already) get a USB 2.0 card for your PC as this will speed the transfer of music across no end!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
Cheers Dan - that's my lunch hour sorted. Now I just have to ask Santa!
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| hayley t wrote: |
| how much cheaper are they in the States? |
Once you've factored in sales tax (in a relatively expensive location like NYC or SF), then at today's exchange rate, you'd get one for £150 as opposed to £180.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
hayley t,
For running or the gym, you're probably better off with one of the cheaper flash-memory based players as they're lighter and have no moving parts. Unfortunately, you'll have to keep changing the music stored on it or listen to the same stuff over and over again. I've no experience of these; I'd suggest you go to your local electronics store and find one that looks, feels and sounds good - they're not very expensive.
I have an iRiver H120 (fantastic device - same size and capacity as an iPod but with a radio and double the battery life), but, like all players with a hard drive, it's not great for exercise. When I go running I have to slow down to a walk for 20 seconds every 15-20 minutes or the sound cuts out; it's also a bit heavy. If you're not a big runner, though, I strongly recommend it.
The other big thing to consider is the format of your music - and that's where iPods have a big problem. When you copy your CDs to your MP3 player, you have to first rip them to your PC in some compresed format. All players accept the MP3 file format, but, as a few others have noted, MP3's not the best for quality. Other alternatives are WMA (accpted by most devices except iPods), Ogg Vorbis (accepted by some devices) and AAC (accepted only by iPods). If you buy music from an internet store, it's usually a copy-protected WMA (all sites except iTunes) or a copy-protected AAC (iTunes only).
That sounds pretty long winded and complex. What it means in everyday terms is this: if you buy music for your iPod, or rip it in the iPod's highest quality format, you can't use it anywhere else - not in your car, not on your phone, not in your DVD player. Don't think that you'll never use that music anywhere apart from on your iPod - the whole world's going digital, and you'll regret the lack of compatibility. I'm just about to install a wireless network at home so that I can listen to any of my music in any room that I want to - fetching CDs from the rack seems incredibly inconvenient and old fashioned these days - and if I had AACs I'd be stuffed.
If you've a half-decent CD collection, ripping it all will be a lengthy labour of love; you don't want to have to repeat it in a year's time. So, my advice is this: if you want a music player with a hard-drive don't buy an iPod. If you must buy an iPod as a fashion statement, don't use the AAC file format or buy music from iTunes. And rip that music at the highest possible quality setting - storage space is only going to get cheaper.
Sorry for the lengthy reply - I hope it makes sense.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I have a MiniDisc but I never use it skiing. My mini hi fi has an optical output so I can rip off a CD onto MD with no loss of quality. And recording a whole CD is a doddle - when the CD starts so does the recording. But last time I looked at mini hi fis none of them seemed to feature this optical output any more. Shame. Entering track details manually is a pain.
If I was buying today, I doubt if I'd go for a MiniDisc. There are very few recordings commercially available and I don't buy CDs now (only the odd music DVD). So one of these days I suppose I'll have to start downloading mp3s ..... until then the MD does fine round the pool deck.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
| Dan wrote: |
Just incase some people don't understand.......................an ipod is still an mp3 player, just Apples' version.
hayley t, just make sure you get one that supports mp3 & wma, and you'll want at least a couple of GB worth of memory. It may be worth going to a large Richer Sounds or music shop and listening to a few, picking them up and finding out what you want........then go buy it on ebay Also if you can afford it (or have it already) get a USB 2.0 card for your PC as this will speed the transfer of music across no end! |
well if you want one that plays wma, that'll rule out Sony and Apple as it's a Microsoft format I think (Windows Media Player), so probably that would mean Creative. Is WMA any better than AAC or ATRAC?
All will play MP3s I think (even Sony now)
The choice of format will limit where you can download stuff from (eg Apple ITunes only does AACs I believe). They will probably be protected so you wont be able to convert them to anything else.
Tunes you copy from CDs are not protected so if you Rip them as AACs you can convert them to MP3, WAV, WMA or whatever (with the right converter)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Jonny Jones wrote: |
| AAC (accepted only by iPods) |
...apart from players from Nokia, Sony and Panasonic, among others
| Quote: |
| If you buy music from an internet store, it's usually a copy-protected WMA (all sites except iTunes) or a copy-protected AAC (iTunes only) |
...apart from Real's Rhapsody, which supports AAC but not WMA.
| Quote: |
| you buy music for your iPod, or rip it in the iPod's highest quality format, you can't use it anywhere else - not in your car, not on your phone, not in your DVD player. |
Not true. Assuming your phone or whatever doesn't support AAC (see above), in iTunes you can burn an audio CD from AAC and then rip-back into MP3. Alternatively, you can download a software conversion utility.
| Quote: |
| I'm just about to install a wireless network at home so that I can listen to any of my music in any room that I want to - fetching CDs from the rack seems incredibly inconvenient and old fashioned these days - and if I had AACs I'd be stuffed. |
No you wouldn't. You could convert as above, or even better, use an Apple Airport Express as a spoke in your wireless network. It's portable and plugs straight into an electrical socket. Position it next to your hi-fi, hook it up to the line-in socket (cable provided), and stream directly from your iTunes computer anywhere in the house. Alternatively, just connect the iPod directly to the line-in.
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
| Quote: |
| or running or the gym, you're probably better off with one of the cheaper flash-memory based players as they're lighter and have no moving parts. |
Both my iPod and my mini iPod are fine for running and around the gym. No skips or pauses, ever.
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
| Quote: |
well if you want one that plays wma, that'll rule out Sony and Apple as it's a Microsoft format I think (Windows Media Player),
|
It is a Microsoft format, but it has been widely adopted. Most devices (except, as you rightly say, those from Sony and Apple) can even play WMA files - even my £39.99 DVD player from Asda.
| Quote: |
Tunes you copy from CDs are not protected so if you Rip them as AACs you can convert them to MP3, WAV, WMA or whatever (with the right converter)
|
You can, but you lose quality. All of these are lossy formats (they're not as high quality as the original), and, each time you move from one format to another, information gets lost. It's a bit like a 3rd generation photocopy - readable but ugly.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Arrgh - info overload! I'm a relative technophobe when it comes to on-line music etc. Let me get this straight, if I get an iPod, I won't be able to listen to the music stored on it via any other listening device, e.g. DVD player, car etc? How would I do that anyway? Also, I thought it was all MP3 format, what is the difference between AAC, WMA etc?
If this is too off-topic I don't mind if all you techies above would prefer to PM me. Cheers!
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
hayley t,
Maybe I misled you slightly by trying to simplify a complex topic too much. If you store your music as MP3s, you can use it on almost anything, including an iPod. For example, you can burn a CD with 100 MP3 tracks on it, pop it in your car radio and it'll probably work (if your car's quite new).
The trouble is that MP3 is an old-fashioned file format that doesn't offer the best quality sound for a given file size. The three best format (repeated independent tests show little difference between them) are AAC, OGG and WMA. Of these, you can only nuy music online as WMA or AAC.
Most of the industry supports WMA. Some supports OGG. Less supports AAC. Only Apple supports AAC with digital rights management (this stops you pirating music). If you store your music as AAC files, you restrict your choice of playback devices and software compared with WMA. Think of it as being like the Betamax / VHS battle of the 1980s.
If you like the look of the iPod, buy one. But I'd stay well clear of AAC files.
Do I sound geeky? 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
No - not too geeky anyway! The sad thing is, my 10 year old cousin probably knows more about this than I ever will!
It makes sense now, thanks. I want to get something that will last a few years, hence your VHS/Betamax analagy applies, so I will go to a store and check everything out before perusing Ebay.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
|
.........you could always store and play all your tracks through the ipod in any format and then connect it to any another device by auxilary ports.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
Ta Dan.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned before, but be aware that when ripping music off a CD onto your computer, make sure that you turn the protection off.
I spent a year or so gradually ripping music onto my machine at work  only discover after getting a flash player that I had to re-rip it all again without the protection turned on to transfer the required songs over!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
hayley t, you might like to switch off here!
jonny, I think the format wars will be interesting for us geeks, but b...y annoying for non-geeks like Hayley. I think AAC is better placed than Betamax was because of the dominant position of the Apple iMusic store. Although, as you say, there's nowt to choose between them technically, I'd hate for WMA to win because it would be just one more area for Microsoft to dominate and then become exploitative.
By the way, the digital rights management of AAC is trivially easy to defeat, using Apple's standard, bundled software! I expect WMA is equally fallible.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
I love my iPod but I leave it behind when snowboarding. Its no fun carving up skiers if you are oblivious to their reactions 
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
laundryman, I don't think I'll be a non-geek for much longer at this rate!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
OH, for those who think that AAC files cannot be used in their cars, the lucky owners of BMWs can now use their iPOD as an in-car device
Check here...http://www.apple.com/ipod/bmw/
So, althought it's true that not that many devices support AAC, ipod can be connected nearly anywhere (to your home HiFi, to your car, err, provided it's a) a BMW and b)not an old one).
Besides, in our backward country, MP3 files and Devices have only now risen to the General Consumer Public attention...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Matteo, there are several different ways to connect an iPod to a car, and it isn't limited to a BMW. Any car with an FM radio, for example, will be able to play music direct from your iPod with the addition of a small FM transmitter.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
| rob@rar.org.uk wrote: |
| Matteo, there are several different ways to connect an iPod to a car, and it isn't limited to a BMW. Any car with an FM radio, for example, will be able to play music direct from your iPod with the addition of a small FM transmitter. |
not strictly legal in the UK though!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
laundryman, the format wars are particularly bad because the dominant hardware provider (Apple) refuses to accept the format of the dominant software supplier (Microsoft) and vice versa. As a result, consumers can get horribly caught in the middle.
A plague on both their houses, I say. Apple isn't exactly a saintly company - it's probably worse than Microsoft when it comes to manipulating the market and stuffing consumers. In an attempt to stitch up the entire supply chain for itself, it refuses to share details of its propriety codecs and has threatened to prosecute any online retailer who dares to sell music to iPod owners.
So, if you're a user, I'd say: don't buy Apple's hardware, and try to avoid using Microsoft's software. Love and peace to the world and death to American capitalists.
Rant over  (yes, kevin mcclean, I do need to get some humour, wit and plenty of other good things too)
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
Jonny Jones, as you implied before, MP3 is the people's format. Apple can't prevent others from selling MP3s to end up on people's iPods. I buy from eClassical.com, which has a much better range of classical music than Apple's store, and at a much better price!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Good news is there is MP4 - not entirely sure what it does though!! 
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
| Quote: |
| Good news is there is MP4 - not entirely sure what it does though!! |
| Quote: |
| http://www.apple.com/mpeg4/aac/ may be useful |
Hmmm, not quite...
(Maybe this thread should be moved to Après Zone.)
Now, take a deep breath...
For those of you who are still there...
MP3 is a contraction of, not MPEG-3, but MPEG-1 Audio Layer 3. MPEG-1 is a standard for computer representation of audio-visual information, e.g. on CD-ROMs. It's quite highly compressed, so that the stuff can be transmitted over modems in a reasonable time, fit on a standard CD etc. There are options (Layers 1, 2 and 3) about how the audio part of that is done. Layer 3, i.e. MP3, is the best quality (but therefore takes up the most space, though usually small compared to the visual information). Almost by accident, it became the default for spreading recorded music around, in the absence of any visual information.
MPEG-2 does the same kind of stuff, but to a much higher level of quality, and has been adopted by the DVD and digital broadcast industries. The audio standard within that is the AAC that Apple has adopted for its music store. For the same file size it produces a better quality than MP3.
MPEG-3 died a death. It is un-related to MP3.
MPEG-4 is a new standard, intended to do the same job as MPEG-1, only better, and to support the higher bandwidth connections available these days. AAC has also been adopted as its high quality audio option.
So, to get back to the Apple/Microsoft argument, AAC has a long pedigree, is open standards based, and is supported across a range of industries by a range of corporations. Then Johnny-come-lately Microsoft comes up with a proprietary system that just isn't needed to muddy the water 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
November's Which? has a report on MP3 players. They've treated disk-based and solid-state players separately. The top five in each category, with overall percentage scores, are as follows:
DISK
1. Apple iPod (86)
2. Apple iPod mini (74)
3. iAudio M3 (69)
4. Archos Gmini (62)
5. Xclef HD-800 (59)
SOLID STATE
1. Digital Square Zillion (70)
2. Sony Net Walkman (64)
3. Creative Nomad MuVo (61)
4. iRiver IFP-899 (59)
5. Rio Cali (52)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
If anyone is looking to get an ipod mini in time for Christmas, you may find that the shops are offering little assurances about deliveries.
If you're in that position, you may be interested to know that last Wednesday I ordered 2 direct from Apple in the states and they arrived today. They were no cheaper than shops here (£179 each), but at least they were available. They also do a free engraving service if you want to add any letters to the back.
Just thought I'd let people know.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
fragglerock, No 4 in the solid state category?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
I don't understand. Why do you want to plug your brains into music ? What's matter with listening to the natural sounds around you ?
(Am I getting old?)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
