@abc, putting force in and being smooth are not mutually exclusive. If you bend a ski in powder like you do on hardpack then more power to you, but ever instructor I've ever had has talked about technique being different when it's soft or chopped up.
It’s the other way around. All the “off-piste techniques” can be used on piste. But the reverse is not necessarily so.
You can use the same “technique” to bend the ski on piste as you are off piste. It’s just off piste, the skis don’t bend nearly as much. Moreover, even on piste, you still have to finesse the edge pressure with different snow conditions (icy vs soft). Or you’ll end up sliding out.
So I don’t see the techniques being one vs the other. But rather a continuum of subtle differences applied appropriately on a continuum of variation of snow conditions.
Last but not least, not all off piste snow are soft. Crud, wind blown, or refrozen snow are anything but soft.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
abc wrote:
SnoodyMcFlude wrote:
@abc, putting force in and being smooth are not mutually exclusive. If you bend a ski in powder like you do on hardpack then more power to you, but ever instructor I've ever had has talked about technique being different when it's soft or chopped up.
It’s the other way around. All the “off-piste techniques” can be used on piste. But the reverse is not necessarily so.
You can use the same “technique” to bend the ski on piste as you are off piste. It’s just off piste, the skis don’t bend nearly as much. Moreover, even on piste, you still have to finesse the edge pressure with different snow conditions (icy vs soft). Or you’ll end up sliding out.
So I don’t see the techniques being one vs the other. But rather a continuum of subtle differences applied appropriately on a continuum of variation of snow conditions.
Last but not least, not all off piste snow are soft. Crud, wind blown, or refrozen snow are anything but soft.
I doubt many would disagree. But the OP wanted to know how good he had to be at carving in order to ski off-piste. He slso talked about going somewhere to get more chance of powder than near home and that he can't turn his skis in bumpy side-piste.
Seems like the OP has one technique (possibly the least relevant to off-piste) nailed and not much else in his tool box. Hence the answers he's getting.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@adithorp, good point. The OP sounds like has only limited technique and needs to broaden his skillset.
The OP also mentioned his past experience with ski instructors had not be very beneficial.
So rather than worrying about “off-piste technique”, it’s more useful to find the right instructor and environment to acquire and practice a more broad based skill set.
Carv did a video about how to work on off piste technique using the carve tool. It doesn't use the IQ for the reasons other posters have mentioned but might be of interest?
Yeah I'd guess that his ability in the offpiste had sod all to do with the Carv prep he did and more to do with many years of skiing it and being a good skier. Clue was in the little bits of air he took in transition between turns.
... Carv did a video about how to work on off piste technique using the carve tool. It doesn't use the IQ for the reasons other posters have mentioned but might be of interest?...
A good find, but that idea of "off piste" appears to be tracked out, skier-pisted, and gladed for skiing. You can see the little moguls under the 10cm of tracked crud.
I wouldn't really consider stuff like that as being off-piste, although legally no doubt it is. The techniques I was thinking of for skiing/ riding deep snow are irrelevant in stuff like that; you can ride it the same as the stuff the other side of the piste markers, obviously. Perhaps that's why there's been some confusion here: we're all talking about "off piste", but I'm talking about snow you can sink your tail in, not that stuff in the video.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@Dave of the Marmottes, Yep, the prep bit did appear to be shoehorned in.
@phil_w, I agree, powder skiing is different and in the right conditions you can hit plenty of powder in the middle of a blue run.
One point I took was that even in the video made by carv for skiing "Off Piste" (i.e. side piste crud) there is no mention of the ski IQ which backs up the view that the IQ is not a particularly useful measure of how ready a skier is for powder skiing.
After all it is free
After all it is free
I get it they have a product that does something in its chosen controlled environment and they want to broaden the appeal. But they are kinda in the business of making their own subscription model obsolete.
People chase higher performance scores on groomed slopes and eventually become decent skiers. But the real win is in locking in that touch and feeling not being continually reinforced by the app. Having become decent skiers they aspire to take it elsewhere where a crude measuring device is nowhere near as useful as mileage and tactics. In either scenario people abandon the product save for refresher sessions unless they become Strava type obsessives (and not saying that there isn't a subset of those "competisumers")
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
To be honest I could probably achieve the equivalent of off piste carve for myself by playing a recording of an instructor telling me to lean back less and get my skis closer together on loop
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
@Henwc, There's a lot you can achieve offpiste with the simple mantra of "Get Forward" aided if necessary by "poleplant more in front".
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@Dave of the Marmottes,
Now you just need to translate "Get Forward" into something that the average intermediate can understand. And do.
I recall back in the day, even before carving skis, being told endless times to do so, and even by BASI trainers, none of whom could give me the ability to actually do it. Eventually worked out how to pull the knee forward after a specific exercise for that, so I suppose I should give the instructor some credit, although even then I had to find the muscles myself, and then re-learn to ski with this new set of tools opened up to me.
That was in an era when you still got some instructors telling you to lean back in powder too
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
The most fun way I have found to communicate the "Get forward" into something my intermediate 10 year old can understand is working on a nose butter 180, it even has the "poleplant more in front" part too
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