 Poster: A snowHead
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>> All peeps who can't do anything last minute cos of kids - why not?
Do you have kids Charlotte?
I guess not, otherwise you'd understand the things that happen at weekends, for me I have ballet lessons, swimming lessons, etc, and IMHO to take advantage of a last minute trip you need to leave Friday, after school/work, and arrive very late Friday, to ski Sat & Sun. So the kids would be back late Sunday, and hence knackered for school on Monday.
regards,
Greg
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Living in the north of England its still far cheaper to drive up to Scotland for a weekends skiing than travel out to the Alps.
The true cost of a days skiing in the Alps is generally well in excess of £125. Its probably more than double the cost of a day in Scotland, but probably not twice as much fun.
I choose to enjoy both , but tend to remember my Scottish days long after several holidays have merged into one. Why is that ?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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easiski, I will confess that it's one of my Dad's & his cronies favourites on their (just about still described as) "boys" walking weekends.
Pleased to see the Struan House is still there, fond recollection of an not-to-be-recommended late night drive to Aviemore for chips as the bar had closed and we were hungry. Hungry fools more like.
I would like to note that I think I have more than the remaining vestige of a Scottish accent. No one else thinks so though 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Peter S, is it? Still? I'm slightly surprised but I haven't checked where the B6277 is!
If you're out of season...and have a convenient enough local loco served airport...(4 day trip example)
Return flights £80 (Gatwick)
Transfer £40 (2 people, tiny hire care, ignoring petrol)
Accommodation £80 (Yep. Booked well in advance)
Liftpass £100 (PDS, normal season rate)
Any extras are your own!
OK, I haven't counted airport parking. I do assume booking adequately in advance and adequately out of season to get decent prices but...
Looks to me like £75/day. Of course, this does not take into account the Terrasse lunches, fine wines, ski testing, et al. but still they seem like interesting economics. I repeat again that I assume you have an airport and non-monopolistic low cost carrier available.
Now, if you can do Scotland for £60 and still make a non-heroic assumption that you will ski a good day every day (I don't mean good weather, just decent snow, decently small queues, and uplift availability) I might have to reverse commute next winter!
Why am I arguing against Scotland? This has been a week where I seem to have recanted, on this very forum, virtually every strong and unfounded opinion I hold dear. Bvgger!!
I'll be buying a pair of Pocket Rockets next!!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Peter S wrote: |
The true cost of a days skiing in the Alps is generally well in excess of £125. Its probably more than double the cost of a day in Scotland, but probably not twice as much fun.
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8 1/2 days skiing in the Dolomites (each for 6 of us):-
Petrol and Parking at airport £15
Easijet flights- about £50 + skis £15
Taxi Transfer to Arabba going out (guide took us back on way home) £ 30
***Hotel 1/2 board 8 nights £245
full Dolomites ski-lift pass £140
lunches and drinks - well, let's call it £200
Guide for 6 days and use of his van £250
Hotel for guide half board £50
Lunches and drinks for guide £20
Lift pass for guide £13
Well, OK, that is about £125 per skiing day, but it includes bringing a famous French guide to the Dolomites (which he knows well) to guide us on the steep (often far-)off-piste for most of the holiday.
Mind you, I agree with the sentiments, and Scotland can be very cheap if you really try.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I've been told on more than one occasion that you can't consider yourself a proper UK skier until you've experienced Scottish skiing. I've not managed yet. 
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David Murdoch,
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As for Dave Horsley, Scottish Ski Bum, I did not advocate one day trips and I didn't mean to but I guess I did hit a wee sensitive nerve? A bit "twitchy" are we?
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So
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Add to that the costs involved... Once Queasyjet, Outspan, et al. expand to doing daily and well timed services Glasgow-Geneva it'll be cost and time effective to day trip to Chamonix compared to a day at the Lecht...
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wasn't a suggestion for day trips to the alps then?
No I'm not twitchy and personally I wouldn't per se recomend a trip up specifically for skiing from the south of England, though a pre arranged long weekend or week to do general outdoor type things including hill walking, skiing etc. would be well worth while and if planned for late february through March would almost gaurantee at least some snow for a bit of skiing.
What has been annoying me is that get one weekend with low level snow in the central belt and everyone and his dog charges up to the ski resorts and complains about the overcrowding, long queues etc. Come the next three weeekends when the snow has disappeared from the central belt, the road conditions are a damn sight better for driving and the snow at the resorts is still very good - top to bottom skiing at the Gorm for example - and the runs are quiet and there are no queues.
I want lift served skiing to be viable in Scotland - I enjoy touring, but not all the time - but it won't be viable if people don't come when we have decent snow.
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The last time I went up to Nevis it turned out there was only skiing on the summit run and Glencoe closed due to not enough snow, so I didn't ski - but I had arranged to go several days in advance, which isn't the way to do it these days. I did do a very nice 8 mile walk, though.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Dave Horsley, "It" was merely an observation not a suggestion, although understandable if it was read that way...
I see your point of view and understand; and I think if I lived where you did I'd be understandably p1ssed off too. So hope no offence taken! 
Who's doing the marketing for "Ski Scotland" these days - as clearly you are having a good time, in some spectacular scenery yet the message isn't getting to those who would appreciate/benefit/enjoy it. Which is not just a great shame, but a wasted opportunity.
And clearly given the ownership/viability issues of Glencoe and Glenshee in recent years someone needs to be doing something more positive.
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I see your point of view and understand; and I think if I lived where you did I'd be understandably p1ssed off too. So hope no offence taken!
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No offence taken I'm much more offended by the fact that if say p1ssed off with an i rather than an 1 it comes out as pissed off .
I'm always surprised by the number of people who assume that as soon as the snow has disapeared at a low level then it must have disappeared from the mountains. Many don't even have the excuse that they live in England or don't ski . I'm also surprised how many can't or don't use the many resources such as the internet or ceefax or even the phone to get an upto date check on the conditions.
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Who's doing the marketing for "Ski Scotland" these days - as clearly you are having a good time, in some spectacular scenery yet the message isn't getting to those who would appreciate/benefit/enjoy it. Which is not just a great shame, but a wasted opportunity.
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I think the marketing is via the people who run this: http://ski.visitscotland.com/ which is run by visitscotland which is, I think, the tourist board. Im not sure they do a very good job, the nordic skiing gave up with them as they got very little for their money.
Yep, I'm having a good time, but perhaps I'm easily pleased and don't expect Scotland to provide the same sort of skiing as the alps. I've had fun at Glenshee when all they had open was the Calybokie beginners run with mainly manmade snow, but it was early season. I was a season ticket holder at Glenshee at the time, so it wasn't costing me anything. It got me into the hills and I got a bit of exercise into my legs. If I got bored I could alwys head into the hills for a walk.
I've done the same at Cairngorm - turned up to find it was blowing a gale so nothing could open - so skiing turned into winter walking instead, I still had a good day. I always take skins with me so if it gets too busy or i get bored when just a couple of runs are open then I can always head off for a bit of touring. Lots of possibilities in Scotland you just have to make the best of the hand that is dealt you on the day - thats half the fun
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And clearly given the ownership/viability issues of Glencoe and Glenshee in recent years someone needs to be doing something more positive.
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It's said Glencoe/Glenshee went bust because of the golf course which was their attempt at diversification. Perhaps if they'd spent the money directly on the two ski resorts and diversified into summer activities there like mountain biking for example they wouldn't have gone bust. Glenshee seems to be making a good go of it since it was taken over, though I haven't been there much since it went bust and I transferd to being a season ticket holder at the Gorm. Can't comment about Glencoe as I've not skied either of the West coast ski areas.
Edit:- looks like admin has toned down/turned off the expletives checker as pissed is no longer being replaced with a milder version.
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Thu 6-04-06 12:30; edited 2 times in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Dave,
I'm looking forward to Easter in the Gorms far more than my week at Chamonix in may.
Crazy possibly - but I know I'll have some great fun in Scotalnd and I know the skiing will be challenging.
At Chamonix I'll have to look harder for the real challenge 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I agree that the way to make a trip to Scotland work is be prepared to do the other things - I had a fantastic trip one year which included 2 winter ascents, the most challenging trip halfway up the tourist path on Ben Nevis I've ever experienced - whiteout, thigh deep, effectively severe weather training and finally when the weather cleared up a pretty decent day at Nevis range.
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You know it makes sense.
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I've got to get back up there. Perhaps next season....
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Some new snow scheduled this weekend 8cm on friday. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Don't jump the gun yet, make sure you are happy with what you see in the webcam before starting the journey. Must bear in mind the snow in Scotland comes and goes quicker than anywhere you know in the Alps.
Been monitoring the condition myself and the look isn't encouraging at the moment.
Don't get me wrong. I support Scottish resorts too but it will have a negative effect if the visitors are not properly informed and go there with a wrong expectation.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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easiski,
I've been doing a lot of xc this year, been into the Clash on something like 10 occasions - mainly evenings after work even managed one race (8.2km in a slow 59 minutes, but not quiet last ). Am also doing a lot of xc at the Huntly Nordic centre either classic on the mats or skate on rollerskis - practice for the summer racing season. There are plans for a hill race up the hill road at cairngorm later in the year, so I'll have to get out and practice for that - so if anyone sees a nutter rollerskiing up hill it might be me. The Huntly Nordic Centre is one place to go - they'll hire xc ski for use in the Clash, or if there is no snow you can hire skis for the mats, or mountain bikes or roller blades. Ifyou want to try rollerskiing you have to take a lesson if you've not done it before which makes it a bit more expensive unless there are a reasonable number of you to split the cost between.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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saikee,
Whats wrong with the skiing at the moment. Gorm is pretty good - was there Sunday and you could ski top to bottom and there has been more snow since. Bottom of the Daylodge was thin/gone so you needed to walk the last 20m to the car park and the run was narrow towards the bottom. The M1 was narrow towards the very bottom, from about the timing hut to the poma, but the lady was complete - best to the tow but passable to the M1 poma, Ciste gulley was complete to the board walks, but traverse out to WW poma was thin (and then you had to walk or skin as the WWpoma is bust - should be running at the weekend though). M2 was complete (was really really nice skiing on Sunday) Ciste and Ptarmigan were complete and there was some offpiste to the right (coming down) of the Ptarmigan tow. Marquises well was complete, snow field from above the restaurant to the summit was complete, snow field on the southface of cairngorm was complete and on Saturday afternoon I was first to ski it - nice soft snow in which I tele'd a series of S's. Cas headwall complete - several people put tracks down the head wall over the weekend.
Pictures from saturday at the gorm
http://www.winterhighland.info/2006/pix/pixalbum.php?pix_id=237
and there is a more recent update here:
http://www.highland-instinct.co.uk/cairngorm/winter200506/apr06/4/index.html
In other words for April conditions at the Gorm are very good, in fact forget the April bit, conditions are just very good (but perhaps I'm easy to please).
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brian
brian
Guest
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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brian
brian
Guest
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brian,
The webcam suggests Lecht is on its way out.
Cairngorm appears to have snow on the run but pretty thin elsewhere at the time I inserted the link. Think I will make my move this weekend.
The condition was far better a week ago IMO.
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brian
brian
Guest
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saikee, if you can I would leave it until Monday. It looks set to be a bit wild at the weekend but it might just clear up nicely and there should be plenty of fresh snow 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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saikee, It's not often you can ski other than on the runs in Scotland - that's a treat, but the photos of Caringorm from4th April linked above look ab fab to me. If I lived where you live I'd be there!!!
brian, don't like whiskey at all - sorry! Don't like red wine either - call me contrary!!!
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Right now the skiing in Scotland is way better than many Austrian resorts....... which are now closed for the season 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| gregh wrote: |
>> All peeps who can't do anything last minute cos of kids - why not?
Do you have kids Charlotte?
I guess not, otherwise you'd understand the things that happen at weekends, for me I have ballet lessons, swimming lessons, etc, and IMHO to take advantage of a last minute trip you need to leave Friday, after school/work, and arrive very late Friday, to ski Sat & Sun. So the kids would be back late Sunday, and hence knackered for school on Monday.
regards,
Greg |
Well - ballet and swimming lessons can go on all the time - what's wrong with cancelling that weekend for skiing? Kids can sleep in car (you can give them motion sickness tablets to make sure), you're knackered, they're fine. Or sleeper bus or train. Leave Sunday lunch (mind you I don't know where you live, but north of Manchester is deffo doable - don't forget, I lived there for 7 years but I've done that drive north more times than I can remember.
Otherwise, if the effort is too much dont' bemoan not going! 
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becos of that article i just read on the home page on the recent snowfall in scotland i am now seriously looking at it for an easter ski weekend, however have no idea of the fiddly practicalities - car hire is not an option as none of my friends can drive (and i get car sick), and i've been told that not only are there no flights near scottish slopes, but no actual ski resorts, just nearby accomodation, and no specific transfer buses from there to the lifts, as no official affilliation between these b & bs and the slopes. Is this true?? So what do people who ski in scotland DO then? How do they get up there if they live in London, where do they stay, how do they commute to the clopes, etc?
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You know it makes sense.
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We do what every Alpine skier would do--- drive to the slope, then drive to the nearby accommodations. Try to ask Swiss, Austrian, French and Itaian skiers and not many of them would understand what are the transfer buses.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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You can travel to Aviemore (for CairnGorm Mountain) or Fort William (for Nevis Range) by train, if your coming from the South then ScotRail sleepers are a good bet, alternatively you can go by coach if you dont want to drive. There is a regular bus link from Aviemore to CairnGorm and from Fort William to Nevis Range.
try www.firstscotrail.com and www.rapsons.co.uk for details.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Ridha, I think peeps are trying to put you off - don't pay any attention - just go!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Ridha I've posted a full reply in the Scottish Skiing in April (Nevis Range) thread where you also asked this question so I won't repeat it here.
Suffice to say the conditions are stunning at the moment and I agree with easiski - don't be put off, just go! 
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FAQ
. I love to blame my fish scale skis (and perhaps if I'd waxed them they'd have been a bit faster on the downhills), but if I'd been using my new racing skis it would probably have been worse as i'd probably have got the wax (klister) wrong and had no kick instead of no glide and would have been even slower 
)
