Snowmageddon, no, really this time...

A snowHead

@davidof, looks like it although I get the impression the bigger issues yesterday were artics blocking and closing the Chatelard tunnel.

A snowHead

@Whitegold, I didn't witness any 'chaos' just a load of snow

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...and there were a few trains cancelled for Nyon from Geneva yesterday evening.
Trains being late counts as chaos in Switzerland, being cancelled is a whole different level.

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It most certainly was chaos in the Valais! Sastrugi on the A9 😳

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The French should make it mandatory to have winter tyres like Germany, Switzerland and Austria, until they do then the BLAH club will always win.....one of the main reasons I don't go to ski in France anymore, traffic in bad weather is a joke.

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@snoozeboy, yikes! Lucky escape!

After all it is free

We are up a fairly steep hill in Chamonix and I tested my ABS on the way down Sat A.M. took about 3m to stop from about 15kph... I drove very carefull and noticed lateral grip somewhat marginal on roundabouts ...

@snoozeboy, that scares the cr?p out of you when that happens.

Proper vintage ( I remember when the river Thames froze over) black ice, that gets all the abs, esp sensors clattering away along with anything else the ecu can chuck at it usually. And one of the conditions that only metal studs can cope competently with to any real degree.

It amuses me when others make reference to winter tyres on here and claim some sort of safety or mitigation against ice like this.

Bet you had adrenaline rush after that one.

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Why don't the French insist on winter tyres like they do in Germany, CH and Austria - surely that's a big contributor to chaos on their Alpine roads?

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The problem on some section of the French motorway north of Troyes yesterday was "pluie verglacant". Masses of warnings on 107.7 in French but although they broadcast short English bulletins they just said "keep good distances between vehicles and reduce speed". No mention of freezing rain nor of the prohibition of overtaking snow ploughs and gritting lorries - which would have been a good idea. If it had left them less time for the truly dire music they were playing, it would have been a mercy! I saw several plough convoys going south - each time there was a plough on both carriageways so nobody could have passed, however daft and impatient they were.

What with the stupendous wind speeds near Calais, the port closed, a ferry aground, being nervous passing high-sided vehicles, reports of black flags and roads in Tignes closed even to pedestrians - did feel a bit like the end of the world.

@snoozeboy, that sounds v scary indeed - good job you found out without cost. I was equally lucky last night - tired when I hit the M25 last night after 5 hours at Eurotunnel and made an elementary driving mistake which could have ended in tears - I got away with it, but very chastening and I drove slowly and defensively the rest of the way. Skullie

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Drove down to SE last night from Lancashire, despite snowmageddon only real inconvenience was Cherwell Valley services being closed and a big of a sketchy slip slide walk for a pee at Oxford plus the usual muppetry of Highways Agency closing 4 lanes of the M25 down into 1 far too early in the evening (not snow related just standard operating procedure). Lighter traffic than usual helped though.

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@snoozeboy, @pam w, glad you're both OK. I too did a late lane change on the M25 (the signs were v misleading) and that was after mashing my car against a notorious - and always invisible to me - low wall in Gary Fat Fingers' drive. Sad

I was glad to get home, but my experience was super-tame in comparison with yours.

A snowHead

So left where we are in Serre Che at 1400m to drive down to shops in Briancon 1,250.

Here temps were +0.5 and raining which was surprising in itself, and in our small parking area puddles were 10cm deep.

As we drove towards Briancon I commented how they seemed to have more snow. By the time we were in the centre it was so really heavily and -2.00.

Coming back out I witnessed a number of crazy happenings on the road. Not least the 10year old 405 in front of me with it's back windscreen covered in snow and then I commented to my OH that his windscreen mirrors were also covered in snow and there's no way he could see behind him. He then signaled to turn right and I could see a small road, however he just turned and went into the snow and the concrete barrier and then could not get back out with his (presumably) summer tyres on.

As I drove past his window was open and I could see the driver and he looked like he'd just come out of the local kasbah, with a total look of bewilderment on his face. Twas probably the most bizarre scenario I've seen for a while.

I should add that Briancon prides itself on how liberal and welcoming they are to migrants.

Driving back out of Briancon it was puking down and a km from where we live it turned to rain and the temp started to rise!!!

Once back here was raining at +0.5

Crazy or what and just been speaking to KenX who lives below Briancon and it's minus 3 and heavy crazy snow and truck being turned back on the main road!

A snowHead

I think a lot of the problem around here was the very fast temperature increase from very cold, temperature inversion and heavy rain. This meant that the salt was washed away and rain fell onto frozen roads, creating the sheet black ice. Snow, even if there's a lot of it, doesn't usually cause much disruption.

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Not just roads that are fecked!

Mate of mine texted me to say TGV he is on bound for Oulx is only going to Modane.

Then he texted to say Chambery, now they're going back to Paris as no decent hotels in Chambery if I understood correctly!

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@snoozeboy, Fair enough, I did see that on the news, I'm glad you were ok. I think we were luckier round here.

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300 people plus on the train, hence going back to Paris - sort of makes sense now.

I've never seen snow as heavy as it was in Briancon this morning, however I'm not exactly a local!

That said judging by all the posts on FaceBook by by friends who are local to the valley this is indeed a major snow fall.

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Snowing heavily again in Verbier on the live feed webcam

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@Markymark29, so presumably not Italy either?

Losing out a lot of options there ...

After all it is free

@clarky999, errr, it’s Italy? Lots of rules...lots of (what’s the Italian version of “gallic”?) shrugs.

You are correct that Aoste at least mandates snow tyres or (available) chains on the motorway between Oct 15 and April 15 (which usually triggers our tyres changes).

And during the original Snowmaggedon the Carabiniere were inspecting cars on arrival in Italy through the MB tunnel and turning back those without snow tyres ....

... unless they were Italians on their way home (!).

As usual, lots of rules, obeyed to the letter if it suits the individual in question.

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P.S. I love Italy.

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it was all predicted here.

http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=134443&highlight=

Very Happy

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@clarky999, Aosta is an autonomous region, I don't think France can impose different laws on certain areas of the country.

@rjs, ???

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@snoozeboy, i didn’t know about, strobing led lights, thanks.
If it’s proper black ice it matters little what tyres you have on.
A couple of years back I parked on a slightly sloping sideways car park at Les Houches, with 4x4 + snow tyres, and my car started to slide slowly sideways. I just managed to reverse out before I hit the car next to me. So I parked it on a flat bit of the car park.
Along came another car, French I think, and tried to park in the same place, I tried to warn him about the ice, but he waved me off with a little contempt. Sure enough he also started sliding sidewards but managed to crash into the car next to him. A little shrug from me was enough.

A snowHead

@jbob, oops.

We had one ignominious return home from The Pub (drink may have been taken) where we and our two friends literally (!) could not get traction on our hill and had to resort to hands and knees.

I would not like to repeat...

A snowHead

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@snowheads68, I take it you didn't check the previous page (see multiple charts for Sat 9th Dec) waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy before your post. It's sad enough to be claiming bragging rights posting a screen shot from a computer model even if you were first, in this case though, well done coming third

Ps to be even better at predictions, try the Op run instead of the Contol run on GFS.

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Friends yesterday driving out stuck on autoroute between Calais and Reims for seven hours!!!

Today we're in effect cut off - Col du Lautaret and Col de Montgenevre closed and mini col south of Briancon at Argentiere closed.

No school or public buses running and Nevache / Val Claree valley cut off closed due to avalanche danger.

Walking the dogs is hard as snow so deep!

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@Weathercam, wow, well I think we made the right choice to drive half way on Sunday and stay at the Val Moret, Troyes area, as although we saw snow ploughs in pairs both ways on the autoroutes on Sunday we were not affected. Yesterday we finished the drive in a frightening amount of rain and wind but no snow till later on in the day here.
David and the dog have ventured out, she has her totally covering coat on and well waxed paws.

After all it is free

No, no-one managed to predict this, at least from the Chamonix Valley point of view. The as-then-forecast snow was exciting and encouraging but not something that would have caused significnat disruption in the normal course of events.

Well, it would in England. But round these parts 20cms in a day is entirely routine.

However ... the snow Saturday night was heavier than expected and didn't turn to rain as forecast. There was a significant absence of snow clearning Sunday morning - I have heard rumours that there was a flash strike, that the Mairie had forgotten to alert them, and various others - who knows. But what (I think) made matters worst was that for some reason there were heavy good vehicles on the roads (normally restricted on a Sunday) getting stuck in the Chatelard tunnel - which then had to be closed for safety reasons until they were recovered.

And the forecast warming and heavy rain did happen over Sundaz night onto a much thicker bed of snow making for lots of unstable snow above some roads and passes...

So a bit of a collision of circumstances.

La Tzoumaz, 4 Vallées Yesterday - We only just managed to get out of the apartment car park without chains on yesterday morning (new hire car and new winter tyres but close) : the roads had only just been snow ploughed (hats off to the clearing teams - up v early and main roads cleared by 7) and we were in a clear weather window before it started snowing heavily at lunchtime. Heaviest snow at this time for 18 years, said our rental agency guy. What was actually more surprising was the snow on the road extended down to the valley. Then heavy rain with temps around 7°C in the valley and very little snow on the ground. On the Autoroute in the section between Lac Lémain and Martigny there were odd bits of compacted then iced snow: dark-coloured and not obvious until you got to recognise them. A mini had hit one and spun into the barrier with his front all smashed-in. It all looked clear so drivers obviously doing the usual 100+ kph then ...

Almost every flight out of GVA yesterday morning was cancelled, up to 11:30 and about half of all the rest seemed to be cancelled as well, although they seemed to be handling it without a lot of fuss. We paid to use one of the lounges in expectation of it being another 2012 when we had to sleep in the Terminal overnight, but our LGW plane was only an hour late.

I just got a 'Level 4' avalanche warning for the 4 Valleys as my MeteoSwiss app is still running, and the local Martigny newspaper is warning about serious dangers of avalanches when the full slopes open-up this Weekend.

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@Weathercam, there's been some amazing photos on FB from Monetier this morning.

Help!!

Snowmageddon, no, really this time...

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