Getting your car to the slopes

A snowHead

@Lizzard, quick? We've beaten people home who we're flying! Sure the flight is quick, but allowing transfers at both end and check in etc it adds up.

But again whatever suits!

A snowHead

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@Lizzard, indeed, darn auto correct

Edinburgh no, Birmingham yes.

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@Boris, viamichelin's travel time from this bit of the Alps to Birmingham is nearly 14 hours. Assuming on-time flights into BHX, the same trip by air would take half that, max. Even flying to LGW and driving to Birmingham from there wouldn't take 14 hours. Racing against a delayed flight is cheating.

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Car or fly. It's a personal choice driven by lots of factors.

These days I drive through choice but for many years was happy for tour operators to take the responsibility for getting us there and back.

Our first ski trip ever ( mid 80's), with our children then aged 10 and 6 with friends, we drove, our friends drove so we thought they knew what they were doing. Asked questions do we need snow chains etc etc? No, they said "It's March there's never any problems in March". So off we set in our Mk3 Ford Escort, did Ok until the last climb up to our apartment when our summer tyres (fwd) and heavily loaded in the back gave up causing a major tailback behind us. With that a car coming down the hill braked, locked up, and slid very slowly and delicately sideways into our front. In spite of that, and having to spend a couple of hours digging our car out at the end of the week, we had the most wonderful holiday and we were addicted from then on.

Many years later after flying with a mixture of tour operators and independent with transfers, one of our daughters announced that she was expecting what would be our first grandchild at around the same time as we had booked our holiday. Obviously we wanted to be able to "be there" for her should she need us but also didn't want cancel the holiday so decided to drive so that we could, if necessary, jump in the car and be home in about 15 hours ( non-stop, 2 drivers).

Since then, apart from one occasion we have driven, the one time we didn't it took 23 hrs elapsed from leaving home to L2A, about 8 hrs longer than driving. These days we have winter tyres, they are stunning although they have had more serious work to do in the UK than the Alps. If we don't get to drive on any snow during the journey then we go and find some during the holiday, usually on deserted ski lift carparks , after hours, to have a "play". Obviously take snow chains, never had to use them.

With just the two of us to worry about we drive, the advantages are:-
1) By departing on a Friday, stopping overnight close to our destination we get to ski all day on the arrival Saturday.
2) By stopping on the Saturday night that we leave close to the Alps we get to ski on the last Saturday as well (8 days skiing instead of 6)
3) Booking direct with the local tourist office for self catering accommodation is about half the cost of booking through a tour operator
4) No surcharges for taking your own skis/boots
5) Being able to fill the car with wine for the journey home ( The extra weight helps with the traction Smile

)
6) 550 miles driving there and 550 miles back in France, it's a real pleasure, in terms of traffic volumes it's like going back in time.

Disadvantages
1) Snowmageddon - see other threads
2) The worry about Snowmageddon
3) 200 miles drive to and from Dover.

Both skiing and getting there has it's risks and rewards and thankfully everyone makes different decisions according to their priorities.

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Flying from East midlands to Salzburg means a door to door journey of around 5 hours, pretty sure no car could beat that. But that's a TO flight so I often do Birmingham to Munich which equates to a door to door time of around 6.5 hours. I enjoy driving but the two days each end that it would use up of my precious holiday time is too much for me.

After all it is free

@Lizzard, But in the real world flights are delayed, particularly charter TO flights. Then factor in the stupidly early start on transfer coach which gets you to airport hours early oh and the get to car park at Brum and the hours drive home then you're closer to 14 hours.

Sure with everything running well and living close to airport it will be quicker. But car can and has been quicker

Of course in real world delays will happen driving so yes flying is generally quicker. But stand by point we have beaten people home

I am not saying I'd win a race from L2A to Brum there was an occasion when La Tania to Leamington we beat my parents home that's all.

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@dogwatch, depreciation will occur on you car even if you don't do that 1000 miles extra though. Of course you have to factor in extra wear and tear and additional costs though which need to be considered

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Depreciation is driven by age and mileage. Cars generally wear out by high mileage these days, not old age. Two year old cars with 25,000 miles versus 50,000 miles are different propositions to price.

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@dogwatch, Indeed but you said an extra 1000 not 25000! Not much difference between 25000 and 27000

Ok, this has been bugging me this morning so I'll try and put down a serious answer rather my flippant comments and attempts to convince everyone that driving is quicker.

Speed
We live roughly half-way between Birmingham and London, so is an hour's drive to each. Allowing time for car parking and check in, I would want to allow 3-hours before flight. Last time we flew, it was roughly 3-hours the other end as well. With stand to stand time of around 2-hours I would say flying would be generally between 8-10 hours door to door for us. Our return car trip is generally 14 hours so yes flying is undoubtedly quicker.

Cost
Tricky one to judge really, mainly as I have no idea what the cost would be for flying as haven't checked in a long time. Last time I looked at flights (not for skiing was to go to Italy for holiday) it worked out cheaper to drive, so am making assumption that for family of 5 the car will work out marginally cheaper. All I can go on is our total holiday cost which is cheaper than I have seen via TO and flights - BUT that's getting into the whole DIY v TO debate which is a different matter. Yep understand that it has an impact on value of car due to extra miles, but as we buy cars around 3-years old, keep them for 4-5 years and put 80K on them I doubt it makes much difference overall.

Convenience
Well for us this is the winner. As we self-cater the ability to stop and buy supplies on the way is worth it, plus we can take our own stuff easily. The keen amongst you will have seen I said our RETURN trip is 14-hours and that's as we usually take 2-days to get to slopes as we enjoy the overnight stop and a relaxed start to holiday (so a lot slower than flying!).

So in conclusion, it works for us and we find it the best way to get there. It won't work for others and flying is best.

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@dogwatch, you buy a car in order to use it for stuff, not leave it sitting in the driveway while you worry about its mileage.

A snowHead

And what;s the financial price for the convenience of your own car when on vacation, vs a rental car?

on a 4 grand holiday, 200 quid is virtually noise.

does one trip really turn a 25,000 car in to a 24,800 car? prolly negotiate more than that.

it';s a holiday. some cost 1000 per person, others cost 900 per person, and sometimes 1100 per person +/- daily nosh costs on the mountain, or a day out treat when s/c.

A snowHead

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The only time we had any tyre trouble in resort was outside the Chalet Fjord in Val D'Isere when some berk (we think it was the chalet bore) let our tyres down! I think he and his equally dense cronies were fed up at having a 4am transfer pick up while we were tucked up in our beds in anticipation of driving to Les Arcs for the day, an enjoyable ski and a leisurely drive home!

No major drama, though, as my mate carried a compressor in the back of the Range Rover and we were as good as new in no time! Very Happy

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My 2 yr old car has done under 20,000 miles even with several drives to the Alps and back. I think town driving with constant gear changes and the odd pot hole hit causes more wear and tear to tyres, brakes, clutch etc. Had we not done those trips and the mileage was only 15000 I doubt it would make much difference to the resale value and I am not planning to change car in the near future anyway.

I think the ski travel cost for four of us is fairly similar whichever mode of transport is used. If you fly the tickets can be cheap but there is the cost of a hire car/ski carriage. Train most expensive for tickets but you can save money by not needing a hire car or expensive transfer. The car is cheaper if you drive in one go but we always stop for a night each way which adds over £200 to the total cost.

For a ski holiday longer than a week, driving seems a good option. For a week or less it seems a long way to drive so we would choose the train (most relaxing) or flights if the resort was not near a station.

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@2planks, Hang on what's rubbish? That flights aren't delayed???? I only mentioned delays, I didn't say cancelled

@dogwatch, No fully appreciate that there are other costs than fuel and tolls, but in overall cost of car they are in my view minimal. If I flew each ski holiday rather than drive, the car would do 4000 less miles, which using your figures would be £800 after 4-years. I can accept that.

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We drive as I am 5hit scared of flying, OH has a comapny car and gets free diesel. It's a no brainer for us. However, if I wasn't so petrified of flying then we probably would and have done a few times when I can be sedated Shocked

After all it is free

@Boris, what I meant is rubbish, is saying that charter operators get delayed more than scheduled.

For us as a family it takes the stress out of the holiday driving there. No worries about what to pack, self catering means you can take stuff with you which can keep some costs down and usually there is plenty of room on the way back to load up with food and wine until the next visit.

The roads are smooth, usually free flowing when we travel or we ensure we drive at times when they will be and its cruise control and some decent music while the kids watch dvd's or play on tablets etc. Overnight in Dijon or somewhere close to Geneva means just one long day, late start on a saturday morning and up to the resort to sneak in some extra skiing or a wander around/sledge before getting into apartment/chalet etc. On the way home, out of the apartment early, shoot back to Calais ahead of the traffic, supermarket, home and a lazy Sunday before going back to work.

Also useful if you want to explore or if local snow is poor....I like the flexibility and in late season its great to be able to ski in the morning and explore in the afternoon in the valley/picnic etc.

...maybe something in me which is OCD and not reliant on transfers and being stuck in a single location if I dont want to be snowHead

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We've been driving to Trois valley and, since we bought an old house in St Jean d'Aulps, PdS since 2007 from MK area

12-13 hours door to door, agreed with other posters that once away from the tunnel and into civilised autoroutes, with only sleepy Belgian 4x4s for company at 2am, driving is a real pleasure. What's with the horrible coffee on the autoroute though?

In all the journeys done lessons learnt -

Stop every two hours, tired or not. Don't drink the coffee out of the machines.

Lots of windscreen washer, -20 c if you can find it

Low profile tyres take a beating, they structurally fail, go out of shape and generally cause a lot of hassle. Buy good ones, no hedgefinders, and keep an eye on them, not just the tread depth.

One time I was parked in Val Thorens out of town car park, having decided on the Friday night that we were going to leave early as the snow was smashing down and it was likely the road would be shut soon. Went to tighten the chains up before heading out, and the drivers side snapped off in my hand, which was disappointing! Cue racing around trying to find chains for sale that would fit ( big tyres on those ZTs) before the shops shut so we could head home...

Other issue was when I hit a rock under snow, which bent the rim so had to drive to Linderets on one summer tyre and one space saver on the front. Packed snow, ice patches and firm grip on the wheel Shocked

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@SnoodyMcFlude, works if you're on your own, but driving is probably cheaper per head for Boris and his entourage of mini-Borises.

You know it makes sense.

When we do a family trip (4 or 5 in the car and I pay for them all) car tunnel and overnight stop.

When we do the lads@ trip (6 of us and I only pay for 1) fly and hire 2 cars.

Horses for courses.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

Family of six, car owes me nothing, fuel through the business = no brainer, but doesn't stop any of the family asking if we can fly every single time!

A snowHead

no one from up north as we are has mentioned north sea ferries overnight hull to rotterdam, now I realise it would not suit everyone but ive found you are not restricted to sat to sat ,arrive in resort in good time for dinner, can get to ferry after work sleep on board and arrive not too tired to enjoy first night then first day and its so easy to add a couple of days on before or after if conditions good or time/ funds allow which to me negates any minor cost savings over being restricted to flight either T/Oor self organized, But im fortunate that I can be a little bit flexible but it works for us 2 old hands

A snowHead

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We do both. For long weekends at our apartment, we'll fly out thu/fri and fly back mon/tues and either hire a car or use public transport to transfer. Fastest door-to-door from Brighton to the apartment (4 Valleys) was 7½ hours. Slowest return trip was 5 days, thanks to Geneva airport being snowed-in, then waiting for 4 days for the backlog to clear.

When the kids were younger and with us, we did packages and transfers. These we OK when eveything went to schedule but we had as many nightmare transfers as good ones, and I hated the way that we always had to get up at 3/4/5am for the return transfer. When they were older, we always drove.

For longer stays my wife and I drive, staying overnight outbound near Troyes and enjoying the Champagne cuisine and drink. On the return leg we sometimes drive in one go (8 hours, strictly changing-over every 2 hours), and some times stay over. In this case we enjoy the ease of packing and self-sufficiency, and the reassurance that we have enough supplies on-board to cope with long delays.

If you do drive, absolutely fit winter tyres. You may be able to manage without them 3 years out of 4 but the difference they make is huge. On our drive home last Weekend, we were able to get over the Jura between Lausanne and Besançon (below) with absolutely no drama or needing chains.

The line of cars we were in saw one car wth chains eventually have to halt in a layby and take them off (too much tarmac on the lower sections); then put them on again; then take them off again ... and a big BMW x5 slide off into the ditch (just 'round this corner, actually), and another SUV almost do the same and another car leave putting the chain on 'till almost too late. We had our winters on (Pirelli Sottozero Serie II) and no drama, cruised at 50Kph, along with all the other ordinary cars similaraly shod.

We've never needed the chains that we carry, and have managed to get up hills on our winters that other cars with chains have found difficult. Not to say that we'll never need them, but over the last ten years we've been fortunate enough for the winter tyres to be enough.

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I've only driven to the Alps once, Livigno in a Lancia Delta Integrale and keep meaning to do it again. Every time I'm sat waiting in the departure lounge or waiting for my luggage I say to myself 'right, I'm driving next year!'. But then every time I come to booking I work out the cost, the massive amount of miles on my car, the boring bits on the motorways and I go back to flying.

One day.....

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You can always mix best (or worst ) of both worlds .... We fly to marseille, pick up a hire car for the week, generaly come with snow chains and have never had much of an issue except one year when we messed about buying a TV after already being delayed by flights and had to drive to resort in a blizzard and in the dark.

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The single traveller cops the worst of everything, driving is expensive and knackering, getting to the airport on public transport is cheaper than driving and paying for parking but a serious faff unless you live next door to the airport. (One that actually goes where and when you want to go)
The debate about flying or driving is a bit pointless as everyone's circumstances are so different.
Last year we all wanted to fly to Andorra but flight times were poor and the cost of fuel to the airport, parking, flights and transfers for four of us was £1250, tunnel free on tesco points, fuel, tolls and depreciation on the car (mpv) came to about £600 not counting the boot full of duty free.

After all it is free

What they said - the idea that there's a single "one size fits all" single answer is wrong.

My algorithm: for each trip, work out what's the best compromise between time/ hassle/ cost, and pick that.

The major cost of vehicle ownership is capital depreciation, depending on how often you change them. That's a sunk cost which you can't factor into the equation for a trip: it's taken already, if you use it or not.

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Getting your car to the slopes

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