Holier than thou parents - *you* are the one exposing your kids to risk by taking them skiing.
If they get hurt then maybe you should consider that before you start dishing out the blame.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Avalanche Poodle,
Quote:
The Flying Gooseberry, Do they actually cast reflections?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
xyzpaul,
Quote:
Holier than thou parents - *you* are the one exposing your kids to risk by taking them skiing.
Very true. Just as I expose them to risks by crossing the road, taking them on a car journey and a million other things that we do. Encouraging children to take increasing (but reasonable risks) is a really important part of parenting.
Quote:
If they get hurt then maybe you should consider that before you start dishing out the blame.
That's fair to a point but if a driver ploughed through a zebra crossing or a speeding driver lost control and crashed into our car then I would be quite within my rights to dish out the blame. Equally if someone skis too fast and close for their skills behind my child and stacks it into them then I am quite within my rights to dish out the blame. And I'm likely to exercise that right in a noisy and colourful fashion
That is an interesting thought... Are there any studies on run design / traffic flow / etc?
Maybe there needs to be some work on sculpting slopes? Adding berms / barriers etc...
There's a crossroads of pistes in Les arcs which has skiers coming from three different directions, choosing to head to two different destinations (or three if you include the nearby restaurant). My guess is it's a bit of a notorious accident zone (I've seen a few near misses there although never an actual collision). Over the last few years the pisteurs have tried different ways of putting slow signs, netting, etc to help manage the traffic. Over the summer they have done a bit of reshaping of the terrain and changed the entry point to the piste which leads to Arc 1600. It wasn't a major change, but enough to redirect the traffic flow to minimise the number of skiers whose trajectories crossed each other. That plus more slow signs and it is now a much safer looking intersection.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
xyzpaul wrote:
Holier than thou parents - *you* are the one exposing your kids to risk by taking them skiing.
If they get hurt then maybe you should consider that before you start dishing out the blame.
That is plain offensive and quite ignorant, and demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of how the world actually works. There is risk in everything we all do, you can no more isolate children from this risk than you can adults and it is a necessary part of parenting to both manage the risk and teach you children how to manage it. Frankly it would be irresponsible to try and isolate children from any all and risks, they would be ill-equipped to deal with the real world.
You also ignore what has actual been said. I for one, and pretty much all the other posters I have seen, freely admit there is a risk to skiing. It is beyond comprehension why you would think I would be to blame if my children were injured through your stupidity/over-estimation of your own abilities/recklessness/negligence. I would not dish out any blame for an accident, that is the risk we all take. I would for something clearly avoidable. Why is that so hard for you to understand? And why do you choose to be so accusatory or offensive? It stinks of defensiveness to me.
The only thing one can do to reduce risk is to stick to the code, be aware of your surroundings and get better at skiing. Yes, there are people who ski in their own bubble, so it's important not to be one of them. We don't have much control of what's behind and above us, so at least we should be looking at what's ahead.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
zikomo, you are quite a belligerent fellow. Perhaps take a chill pill and think carefully about what you have written.
Of course, it is impossible to avoid all risk in skiing, except by not participating. If you choose to take your kids skiing, you have made a decision to expose them to that risk. Should a risk be realised, ie an incident occurs, you can try to apportion blame, but in the end it was your decision that put them in that situation.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
fatbob,
There is enough stupid in that video for everyone concerned to cop a share. The boarder deserves to have someone take a bandsaw to his snowboard and the father needs to learn that stopping in the middle of a crowded piste is a bad idea. I guess having some douche T-bone your child is hard way to learn that. The boarder's parents have failed as human beings.
I think there's been a mindset difference evident in this thread. The code isn't going to protect you from idiots because they are, by defintion, idiots. It also isn't going to offer restitution because it isn't the law. Local legal practice may be informed by some of the principles in the code but that's going to vary a lot - the bar in the US outside of Colorado iirc is recklessness. Not getting hit means skiing defensively and anticipating what might happen up the hill as well as what's going on in front.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Skiing in EK last week I was wiped out by a boarder. A lady was skiing to my right at the same speed as me, with my partner to my left and slightly behind me. The boarder came from behind and tried to go between the skier to my right and I. He hit her quite hard, though she managed to stay on her skis, then he speared left into me. When we came to rest, he just looked at me, then stood and rode away. I saluted him in the traditional manner. At the bottom of the next lift, he and his 3 buddies were waiting, as he was apparently outraged at my hand signal. He did seem to be a little less outraged as I approached him though, as I am quite a big chap. His mates also suddenly seemed very interested in scratches in their boards. Then the other skier he hit arrived and she started giving him hell in French, it was hilarious really.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
skinanny,
It's good to hear that awareness of slope safety is a taught thing, perhaps people forget the teaching as they get older or get blase to the constant reminders that the people that ignore the safety demo on an aeroplane.
Quote:
I've also done speed control/safety patrol on our home run, which is known to be one of the 4 most dangerous runs in N. America at 3pm on a busy Saturday
Sound a great thing to have in place - how does it work? Do you literally tail the perpetrators and deliver a lecture when you catch them?
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
gorilla wrote:
Not getting hit means skiing defensively and anticipating what might happen up the hill as well as what's going on in front.
Yup. Was very conscious of this skiing some very very crowded cattracks recently, sooner or later someone was going to get hit, I spent as much time looking over my shoulder as forward and was very careful to stay in my lane although those that believe the FIS code is gospel would say that there is no such thing as lanes.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:
Not getting hit means skiing defensively and anticipating what might happen up the hill as well as what's going on in front.
Yeah, its a bit like crossing the road on a zebra crossing - the Law says cars must stop, but only an idiot would step out into the road without looking. Its all well and good being "in the right", but its much better not to be dead.
However fast I might go I'm always aware someone's going to be faster, so never (well mostly never) close off a gap (e.g. turning towards the edge of a piste) without a quick glance over my shoulder first.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
kerb, +1
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
fatbob, no justification for the father to punch the snowboarder... but that article is hardly good journalism...
"He swerves and balances himself off her shoulder, when on his right from what appears out of nowhere is another small child on skis, who Daniel can't avoid hitting."
The whole thing is written to make it appear that it was not the snowboarder's fault - but it is easy to see from the early video that whatever his speed he is going considerably faster than the majority on that slope and he is heading straight down through a bunch of small skiers who are beginners and traversing the slope - no attempt to avoid them - yet somehow not his fault?! Totally his fault.
Alasdair
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
^
Quite. "Appears out of nowhere" is nonsense. Around 0030 you can see the girl coming slowly and steadily from his left. If he'd anticipated properly, he could have turned left and crossed behind her.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
akirk, dogwatch, just what I was thinking. There's plenty of time to anticipate - even at the boarder's elevated speed - but no evidence that he has rudimentary awareness, nor the ability to steer. A slap is going too far, but he needs a stern talking to, not put on TV.
Yeah article is skewed - Go Pro perspective does confuse things a bit but ultimately boarder is responsible for coming together with girl (though she could have perhaps been skiing more defensively) Then as a consequence he hits kid. In mitigation, to me it looks like he's on margins of any control by then and is trying to avoid the thing he can see which is dad. It's just his bad luck/fault of dad that kid pops out from stationary behind the blind screen and he point blank hits him.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Think even that is far too kind fatbob - he chose a very poor line and was too close to other sliders for his ability as a result he nearly hit the first girl. Totally his fault. All the rest stemmed from that. Of course the Dad shouldnt have smacked him but judging by the complete lack of serious mea culpa for causing the whole mess in that video he probably didnt help himself in the aftermath.
I don't dispute boarder's primary accountability. I'm not sure he goes as far as wanton recklessness as earlier he is riding at the speed of prevailing traffic, they just all enter a steeper pitch packed with beginners and he's the one who makes the worst choices. Dad, BTW makes a terrible choice in screening (what I guess to be) a static child then letting him out into traffic without looking - potentially (unwittingly) breaching 2 elements of the FIS code.
Just for zikomo - Holier than thou parents, you might think you're keeping your kids safe by screening them on the slopes but you might be making it more dangerous if you don't do a VERY good job.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Megamum, those that are speeding usually get caught by ski patrol and get their passes pulled - we're really looking for repeat offenders and often know the person. My part is to warn people of their excess speed, and advise others to ski in a more predictable manner - telling them to stay to one side or the other of the run in most cases. And then there's always that one person who needs a lead to get down at all, or a small child who is over faced by the terrain.
After all it is free
After all it is free
skinanny, You have to be a bit of r word not to chuck in a couple of exaggerated turns when there's a red or yellow jacket standing in a slow zone regardless of what kind of cowboy you actually are.
The only time I've had a serious run in with a Volly Patroller was when he insisted on enforcing his concept of slow on a totally empty run at the end of the day. Let's just say we differed in opinion on his jobsworth attitude and level of risk posed (plus I had a day ticket that was no more use to me at risk )
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
fatbob, he handles the girl in the seafoam jacket really badly. She's clearly an early intermediate.
Someone on TGR observed that there is a trend for people to post this sort of stuff to Youtube and then whine about how an accident that was blatantly there fault is not, in fact, their fault. I blame helmet cameras (that I own one is, of course entirely beside the point).
Is a beauty. Marvel at the way the first snowboarder comes across the skier forcing him to slow thus lining him up for the second snowboarder to plough right into him. It is the acme of incomptence.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
gorilla, How on earth did that boarder manage to hit the skier? He had loads of time and acres of space. Idiot!
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
gorilla, Ha - is POV guy trying to claim somehow that one isn't his fault? Brilliant almost deserted piste, zero skillz?
The other POV phenomenon is the accidents caused by the "showing off for the camera" factor which are numerous.
In the other one seafoam girl was travelling at his speed previously so they are probably about similarly incompetent. In this instance though she's on the side of the angels But you're right about poor handling early intermediates deserve a full open palm smack down rather than a weak shoulder push, obviously
[/internet hardman] I once took a undignified fall at Hemel because I didn't have the heart to fend off a middle aged out of control woman who steamed straight into me at the bottom
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
fatbob, in respect of helmet cam douche #2, indeed yes. The comments on the YouTube thing are hilarious. millenials.
in respect of #1, clearly he should have barged her 20 ft into the woods.
I'm clearly going to have a horrible accident this year at which point comments here will come back to haunt me.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
gorilla I'm still trying to work out how they managed that on a totally empty piste into a STATIONARY man...I know he stopped somewhat central but the entire piste is empty! I also like how the other skier just sweeps on by.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
gorilla, that's about the most incompetent thing I've seen.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
This is old but always worth reposting.
Incompetent Skier out of his depth in St Anton & this why groomed pistes are very Dangerous !
Mind you I was somewhat miffed the day I got yelled at for taking a positively measured and safe route past an instructors tail of kids who were effectively hogging/blocked a piste of a perfectly decent width. The fact that I had been holding back working out the best plan of action and then had planned and timed my turns to be the opposite of the kiddie string and therefore entirely safe IMO made it even worse when I got a mouthful of verbal from the instructor as I went past. Can you imagine me as a hooligan!! ?
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:
Can you imagine me as a hooligan!! ?
You have to ask
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
meh wrote:
gorilla, that's about the most incompetent thing I've seen.
And then he edits a video around it. Makes me wonder just how sorry he was. If I'd done that I'd be so ashamed I'd delete the video rather than post it for the world to see.
rob@rar, I think his comments on youtube show that he's not at all sorry. Just bleating about the skier stopping in the middle of the piste (about a couple of cricket pitch lengths from him).
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
rob@rar, that doesn't surprise me, the Internet is full of morons posting videos of their attempts to wipe themselves or someone else off the planet. As per laundryman he's not at all sorry and some of the commenters are defending him!
I am not even convinced that the skier does stop, that is only what he says. He knows he is wrong at the time which is why he says sorry to the guy and actually sounds like he means it. some of the comments from boarders on there are ridiculous. my favourite is the guy trying to explain how difficult it is to stop on a board so it is the skiiers fault. my answer to him would be get off the f***ing piste until you can either stay a safe distance or find a way of stopping
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
stanton, it's like the four dickheads of the apocalypse are after you, three hunting you down and one behind the camera....I say we interrogate everyone named Ben.... just for starters!
After all it is free
After all it is free
dode, I know a dickhead named Ben, I think I will give him a Chinese burn whether it's him or not
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
gorilla, thanks, that Board v Angry Skier vid actually made me angry. Gets the Darwin Award tho' for filming and publishing the evidence against himself.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
it's not just that he posted it, he actually spent quite a bit of time putting that video together - what a complete @rsewipe!
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
millenials.
I'm still trying to work out how they managed that on a totally empty piste into a STATIONARY man...I know he stopped somewhat central but the entire piste is empty! I also like how the other skier just sweeps on by.