 Poster: A snowHead
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@Skibum82, @D G Orf, as far as I can deduct from the published e-mail, it was a reply to FR inquiry. I might be wrong in my interpretation, but I read it as there was an onging exchange on the matter and making 'conclussions' from one separate email is not very clever. one episode is not very informative, so lets not rush with conclussions in daily fail or ukip style
Any umbrella organisation/association has the duty not only to look after its members but also the duty to follow applicable rules/agreements.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@mooney058, the issue is that they removed the MOU told the Authorities at once then waited until after he had been arrested to inform him of what they had done, to put it another way, imagine the DVLA decided that for some reason they were wrong and should not have issued you a driving licence, they then tell the police you have no licence who then arrest you for driving without a licence and then a few weeks later the DVLA decide to tell you that you don't have a licence.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@D G Orf, Precisely.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Dave Renouf sent what could be described as an arrest warrant to the French on thw 7th, has a perfect opportunity to inform him personally at the BASI EGM in Morzine Jan 25th where they both gave presentations, arrested at gun point 18th Feb 14, cleared at great expense to all and reputation. Dave Renouf should face disciplinary for gross misconduct and bringing the association into disrepute,
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Skibum82, I tend to not trust speculations and partial information as it could be misleading. You provided one of the many case documents (I assume there are many more in the case) and make assumptions and provide qualifications to actions - on the basis of this single document? This is not clever. If I read the email you posted - it is rather neutral in content and style and it appears to be (in my reading of it) a reply to a previous enquiry - see "you have brought to our attention" paragraph. What happened or did not happen between SB and BASI is a speculation - I do not know it, you most probably do not know it either. Unless there is other data/evidence suggesting otherwise, your qualification of events is just gossiping. I am on neither side here - but for the sake of clarity, please stick to facts.
The way I read the posted email:
a) SB was a holder of MoU sticker;
b) SB made a request of recognition for right of esablishement (rather strange as under point "a" he already had an MoU sticker). I assume this request prompted FR authorities curriosity - why a person with an MoU sticker made a request of recognition that would lead to the same MoU sticker?
c) FR made inquiries, BASI checked and replied. Did BASI had control over FR authorities further actions? You seem to assume so.
The actual question is whether previous sticker was issued by mistake (administrative error or not). How did this mistake occured?
If it was an administrative error, then indeed both SB and FR should have been informed at the same time. Why it did not happen - an administrative mistake again?
Assuming that a factual reply = an arrest warrant - sorry, daily fail level material ...
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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There are at least 14 other BASI members who are in Simon's situation with the same "administration error", ISTD without MoU stamp and who were denied access to the French market.
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@mooney058 seeing your post being number 666 is quite telling
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Basi are a joke. As are the esf.
But BASI properly take the biscuit. Coaching with fear....that's what BASI trainers do....
I got sick of jumping through hoops and putting up with Scottish doctrine.....
Canadian system was a breath of fresh air.
Shame....
Shame on BASI.....
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Jwh138 wrote: |
Basi are a joke. As are the esf.
But BASI properly take the biscuit. Coaching with fear....that's what BASI trainers do....
I got sick of jumping through hoops and putting up with Scottish doctrine.....
Canadian system was a breath of fresh air.
Shame....
Shame on BASI..... |
Can you explain that? Personal experience?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@SkiPresto, So are you going to fill in the Forms?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| SkiPresto wrote: |
http://francepleinair.fr/declaration-lpsle/
Fill in the form and for Euros 300.00 (I'm told) Robert est ton oncle! |
Why not do it direct with the french authorities for free?
I have recently applied for my carte pro, will be interesting to see what they say. Not sure if anyone has tried to get one with NZ quals before.
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| jimmer wrote: |
| SkiPresto wrote: |
http://francepleinair.fr/declaration-lpsle/
Fill in the form and for Euros 300.00 (I'm told) Robert est ton oncle! |
Why not do it direct with the french authorities for free?
I have recently applied for my carte pro, will be interesting to see what they say. Not sure if anyone has tried to get one with NZ quals before. |
This, ^ sounds a bit like the old £9.99 and we'll process your ehic application scam when it can be done direct for free.
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You know it makes sense.
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| jimmer wrote: |
| SkiPresto wrote: |
http://francepleinair.fr/declaration-lpsle/
Fill in the form and for Euros 300.00 (I'm told) Robert est ton oncle! |
Why not do it direct with the french authorities for free?
I have recently applied for my carte pro, will be interesting to see what they say. Not sure if anyone has tried to get one with NZ quals before. |
You can fill the forms in directly & submit yourself. The only problem with this option is that the French quiet often say they have never received them. The defence in SB's case said they had never received his papers. This was proved wrong as they were submitted by SB's solicitor to the Prefecature's solicitor directly. A little like the DX system in the UK.
Jimmer do you have British/EU nationality? If not they will reject as they have no agreement with NZ.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| stewart woodward wrote: |
This was proved wrong as they were submitted by SB's solicitor to the Prefecature's solicitor directly. A little like the DX system in the UK.
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In France everything important has to be done by recorded delivery with proof of delivery. Just a lesson if you ever send important documents.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| stewart woodward wrote: |
| jimmer wrote: |
| SkiPresto wrote: |
http://francepleinair.fr/declaration-lpsle/
Fill in the form and for Euros 300.00 (I'm told) Robert est ton oncle! |
Why not do it direct with the french authorities for free?
I have recently applied for my carte pro, will be interesting to see what they say. Not sure if anyone has tried to get one with NZ quals before. |
You can fill the forms in directly & submit yourself. The only problem with this option is that the French quiet often say they have never received them. The defence in SB's case said they had never received his papers. This was proved wrong as they were submitted by SB's solicitor to the Prefecature's solicitor directly. A little like the DX system in the UK.
Jimmer do you have British/EU nationality? If not they will reject as they have no agreement with NZ. |
Yeah it's not that easy to get the French to accept they have all your forms, but still not worth 300 euros. I am British.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I'd forgotten I'd started this. I'll pull the papers together and post them off.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@jimmer, who did you ask on the timescales? The max time is dictated by EC directives and surprise the French will delay as long as possible... It used to be 5 months max but the new directives is 2 or possibly 3 months...
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| @jimmer, who did you ask on the timescales? The max time is dictated by EC directives and surprise the French will delay as long as possible... It used to be 5 months max but the new directives is 2 or possibly 3 months... |
I asked the charming French lady who has been losing my forms, Celine. Yeah she said 'about 3' so who knows really, I am not too worried. I think they will probably want me to do the mountain safety, but fingers crossed they just give me the carte pro.
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| @jimmer, who did you ask on the timescales? The max time is dictated by EC directives and surprise the French will delay as long as possible... It used to be 5 months max but the new directives is 2 or possibly 3 months... |
I asked the charming French lady who has been losing my forms, Celine. Yeah she said 'about 3' so who knows really, I am not too worried. I think they will probably want me to do the mountain safety, but fingers crossed they just give me the carte pro.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@jimmer, Funny how when you send in forms by recorded delivery they continually get "lost". They also moved office and didn't notify anyone and all paperwork sent in to old address never was forwarded ...
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| @jimmer, Funny how when you send in forms by recorded delivery they continually get "lost". |
but losing forms is their problem, at least in terms of timing
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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SB is Ms? that is funny 
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| davidof wrote: |
| skimottaret wrote: |
| @jimmer, Funny how when you send in forms by recorded delivery they continually get "lost". |
but losing forms is their problem, at least in terms of timing |
Don't think so, the assessment period seems to begin once they judge the dossier is complete.
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You know it makes sense.
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^^ oh dear.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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@SkiPresto, You still haven't answered my question
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| So are you going to fill in the Forms? |
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Strong stuff!:
"The real problem comes from the British Association of Ski Instructors (BASI), which has never
defended its qualified members, either due to their incompetence or to their collusion with the French
authorities in the limited interest of certain individuals.
The “Eurotest” is not an obligation!!! These judgements prove that the Directive applies in full and
that mutual recognition of qualifications is absolutely compulsory, in the absence of demonstration of
the existence of a substantial difference, or otherwise, if professional experience compensates the
demonstrated difference. The judgements also confirm that the added value of the MoU and the
Delegated Act in preparation can seriously be questioned: the Commission must simply insist and
even demand that the Directives should be enforced by the Member States.
British BASI 2’s, BASI 3’s and BASI 4’s can work without the “Eurotest”.
This question should have been dealt with at the EU level for many years if BASI had defended British
ski instructors and had not accepted arrangements committed in violation of the law."
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I liked this bit
> The declaration processes remain fairly complex and French administration is very
inventive to fail the declarations for formal reasons.
I've just got back from the prefecture where I have a filing with them for something else.
"Your file is incomplete, it lacks these documents"
I show them their guidelines with the required documents, the one they gave me
"Yes we have our own guidelines which are different"
Ok care to show me what is on your paper. What is even more fun is that every prefecture has a different set of guidelines - so are they just making things up or has there been a decree or something given what guidelines they should adhere to?
btw not ski instructor qualifications thank gawd!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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It is a well known fact that French bureaucrats have their own individual interpretations of the rules. It is a fact of French life. Accept it if you want to work or live in France
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Rabbie, We're all European now. Oh, hold on....
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Single market? Hilarious. Well done to the French judiciary though, if not the French civil service.
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@AndAnotherThing.., 
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Anybody going to the AGM this weekend in Morzine?
Do you fancy asking why there is an amount of £140k in the accounts for legal fees when all along we have been told the SB legal fees would be covered by insurance? Perhaps there was a limit on the legal insurance we were not told about?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Why is the AGM in another country at the time when most members will be scattered about Europe (or farther) teaching? That seems a bit off to me. Wouldn't it make sense to have the AGM out of season or do they have to be done close to the end of the tax year in the last quarter?
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@flangesax, the AGM is usually held in the UK in November, in different locations each time (e.g. the snow domes at Hemel, Tamworth, Manchester; London Ski Show; Aviemore; etc). A General Meeting is sometimes (always?) held in the winter season in places such as Morzine or Hintertux.
Wherever the location AGMs and GMs are very poorly attended, and only a small proportion of the membership vote (by post or online).
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FAQ
Seems like a bargin to me.
