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Hokkaido Trip Dates Question

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I am considering going to Hokkaido in 2022 and was wondering what dates to avoid. I know Chinese New Years and a week+ after that and Christmas/New Years are definitely avoid periods. Are there any other times avoid?


Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Sun 31-01-21 22:49; edited 1 time in total
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:
I am considering going to Hokkaido in 2020...
Typo in your user name - it should read timemachine... Toofy Grin
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Aussy school hols and Chinese New Year. Each year calendar shifts a bit so google before committing
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If I end up doing Japan in 2022 - would look to fly in around the 5/6 Feb, either way assuming the season happens and aussies can travel without restrictions, there is so much pent up demand to travel in the market I wouldn't be surprised if it was busy throughout.

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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Given I am not an Aussie. Does anyone know when or about when those school holidays would be?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
Aussies holidays finish ende of January
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
I recomended you arrive 5 February
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@skimachine, usually mid December to end of January
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skimachine wrote:
I am considering going to Hokkaido in 2022 and was wondering what dates to avoid. I know Chinese New Years and a week+ after that and Christmas/New Years are definitely avoid periods. Are there any other times avoid?


What are your attempting to avoid?

Crowds on the slopes?
Crowds in the restaurants?
Highest prices?

For example, the Chinese New Year period sees some of the highest accommodation costs; busy restaurants; but very little competition for powder - from both guests and workers.

And that's just for Niseko United, Rusutsu, Kiroro, Tomamu, Furano, and Sahoro.

Let us know what your ideal trip would look like and we can give more specific recommendations.
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Thank you everyone for your help and Mike Pow, thanks for offering to provide more specifics.

I am looking to avoid all 3 of course, but #1 after snow quality are cost and availability of accommodations. #2 is crowds on slopes. Crowds in restaurants is almost irrelevant to me.

My plan is to be as flexible as possible so I would rent a car. I realize the distances may not be great, but the travel time is long or travel maybe impossible due to weather.

I am looking at visiting Furano, Rusutsu, Asahikawa (exact mountain determined night before based upon weather/conditions), and Otaru (exact mountain determined night before based upon weather/conditions). I plan on going off-piste for a few days with a guide, slack/side country and on-piste for the remainder of the days. I am not looking to impress anyone so I don't care how steep the slopes are although I can handle some pretty tough stuff.

Right now I am thinking Feb 7-19 or Feb 14-26 for ski days although I could go anytime.
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skimachine wrote:
Thank you everyone for your help and Mike Pow, thanks for offering to provide more specifics.

I am looking to avoid all 3 of course, but #1 after snow quality are cost and availability of accommodations. #2 is crowds on slopes. Crowds in restaurants is almost irrelevant to me.

My plan is to be as flexible as possible so I would rent a car. I realize the distances may not be great, but the travel time is long or travel maybe impossible due to weather.

I am looking at visiting Furano, Rusutsu, Asahikawa (exact mountain determined night before based upon weather/conditions), and Otaru (exact mountain determined night before based upon weather/conditions). I plan on going off-piste for a few days with a guide, slack/side country and on-piste for the remainder of the days. I am not looking to impress anyone so I don't care how steep the slopes are although I can handle some pretty tough stuff.

Right now I am thinking Feb 7-19 or Feb 14-26 for ski days although I could go anytime.


Once you get away from the more popular areas - Niseko; Rusutsu; sometimes Kiroro; Asahidake in January; Sapporo Teine and Sapporo Kokusai on weekends and Japanese holidays - then you won't have to worry about cost & availability of accommodation. Especially if you're prepared to stay in cities (Otaru, Asahiakawa, Hakodate, Sapporo, Chitose) or smaller towns and travel to the slopes each day.

Snow quality is a small gamble.

Typically December and January are the snowiest months, but with minimal clear days.
February normally gives 3-4 per week and then clearer weather
March is the sleeper on Hokkaido - everything is filled in and you can ski everything; 2-3 snow events per week; bluebird powder days; deserted; easy driving

Either of your timeframes should see you get the goods

Niseko based
Niseko United, Niseko Moiwa, Rusutsu, Kiroro

Otaru based
Otaru Tenguyama, Asari, Sapporo Kokusai, Sapporo Teine, Kiroro

Sapporo / Chitose based
Otaru Tenguyama, Asari, Sapporo Kokusai, Sapporo Teine, Kiroro, Mt Racey

Furano based
Furano, Mt Racey, Tomamu, Sahoro, Kamui, Asahidake, Hidaka Kokusai

Asahiakawa based
Kamui, Pippu, Asahidake, Kamoidake, Katsurazawa Kokusetsu, Nayoro Piyashiri

Hakodate Based
Hakodate Nanae, Greenpia Onuma, Niyama Kogen, Sunlaiva Noboribetsu, Rusutsu (on the back end)

Resort info
https://www.snowjapan.com/japan-ski-resorts/prefecture/hokkaido

If you're prepared to follow the snow and drive to the smaller ski areas you'll have a ball.

Have a look at my Instagram account in the 'From The Archive' posts to see images and videos of some of these areas.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Wow, thanks for all the good info Mike.

Can you tell me how to "follow the snow"? Where is the best source of such information.

Just wondering, what goes on at Asahidake in January?

My concern now is places to sleep. I am certainly not looking for anything fancy. Small is fine. I prefer not hostel type. Do you have any ideas for Furano, Rusutsu, Asahikawa, or Otaru?

Is there any reason or benefit to fly into or from Asahikawa rather than Sapporo from Tokyo?
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Mike Pow is the sage, but:
Don't write off Niseko (I'm 20-plus weeks in here and still love it; easy and brilliant and not too expensive if you are used to European prices).
Best time I think starts one week after NYE and runs to end of Jan (great snow, noticeably less people).
Ski safari by bus - easy, excellent, cheap (tick-off Niseko, Furano, Tomamu... and easy to add on Kiroro day trip).
Asahidake - mmmm, whole thread needed on this! Windy means shut and often...
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@skimachine, Regarding following the snow, the JMA website has tonnes of really useful information on it - hourly snow depths, cloud radar, high res forecasts etc. I found this really helpful and we rarely picked the wrong place on the day. Start watching it now and comparing it to the snowjapan and 360 Niseko daily reports and the other ski areas daily reports on Instagram and you'll get a feel for what weather patterns/wind directions etc to watch out for. That said, the weather is notoriously unpredictable and there is a danger of overthinking it.

Can't recommend the Grand Park enough if you are staying in Otaru. Great value, impeccably clean, spacious rooms and well situated for easy access to a lot of the local ski areas. I suspect that any of the budget business hotels in Japan will probably be great. We stayed in a few different ones in Tokyo, Sapporo and Chitose and they were all basic but excellent.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Thank you so much everyone. Lots of great info. Except for COVID the stars are really lining up great for a 2022 trip.

Wiigman....you mention ski safari by bus as being cheap. Could you point me in the right direction? The ones I have seen have been roughly 310,000 JPY for 6 ski days.

Element: Grand Park is on my list.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
A few years back we (@Sharkymark @Harrison the Rabbit and I) hit Hokkaido, mid Feb to do something very similar to what you're describing..

We got heavy precipitation every day for the 2 weeks we were there - mostly snow, although there were 2 days rain over the middle weekend (tbf It was a relief as I needed the rest after 4wks solid skiing anyway and we hit Sapporo in an enjoyable way that we wouldn't have got around to if we'd had solid snow)

When we arrived, we had a hire car ordered and 2 nights booked in a hotel in Sapporo - which was fortunate as a couple of bags had missed the flight (bags of skis, clothes, everything) and it was useful to have an address to have them delivered to, which they were, exactly 24hrs after we got there.

Everything else, we made up as we went along - following the weather, booking hotels for a night or two at a time, very last minute. This worked excellently, which was demonstrated perfectly when we spent an impromptu day at Risutsu because it looked like the weather might be a bit heavy in Niseko. Got to Niseko that night after skiing in >2 feet of fresh all day, to find everyone really stoked that 'tomorrow was going to be epic' as a fantastic storm had closed their lifts all day today.

In all, we did Asari, Furano, Kiroro, Risutsu, Niseko and Tiene. Tiene had the steepest bits.

The whole lot cost me £2050, including flights Milan=>Sapporo=>London. Although that was before the 2016 disaster and the £ has been worth on average 15-20% less since then. So by that measure, we'd be looking at about £2500 for the same trip now.

This sort of trip wouldn't suit everyone - we were all happy to be 'wandering' with a set of 'intentions' but without firm plans.
The one thing I would want to improve a little though: we got a very basic car. There were times we'd been skiing all day in -10C then needed to do a drive, maybe 2 or 3 hours in heavy weather to our next stop and a little more warmth and comfort at those times would have improved the experience a lot.

I rather fancy doing similar again next Winter, if it's possible snowHead
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
skimachine wrote:
Wow, thanks for all the good info Mike.

Can you tell me how to "follow the snow"? Where is the best source of such information.

Just wondering, what goes on at Asahidake in January?

My concern now is places to sleep. I am certainly not looking for anything fancy. Small is fine. I prefer not hostel type. Do you have any ideas for Furano, Rusutsu, Asahikawa, or Otaru?

Is there any reason or benefit to fly into or from Asahikawa rather than Sapporo from Tokyo?


I use snow-forecast.com

Pretty accurate for freezing level, wind speed & direction, normally under-reports snowfall.

Lots of guided groups in Asahidake in January.

I use booking.com for accommodation

Stayed in the Court Hotel in Asahikawa

Unwind Hotel and Bar, Otaru

Stayed here which was close to some of the smaller ski areas

Mikasa Tennen Onsen Taikonoyu Sparesort Hotel Taiko Bettei Hatago


These guys for Rusutsu
https://stayrusutsu.com/


If you intend skipping Niseko then Asahikawa is good.

If not, then Chitose is better.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
wiigman wrote:
Mike Pow is the sage, but:
Don't write off Niseko (I'm 20-plus weeks in here and still love it; easy and brilliant and not too expensive if you are used to European prices).
Best time I think starts one week after NYE and runs to end of Jan (great snow, noticeably less people).
Ski safari by bus - easy, excellent, cheap (tick-off Niseko, Furano, Tomamu... and easy to add on Kiroro day trip).
Asahidake - mmmm, whole thread needed on this! Windy means shut and often...


Absolutely.

The key to the Niseko Resort Area is having your own wheels and not starting your day at the Grand Hirafu lifts. Drive to Annupuri, Niseko Village or Hanazono.

Drive to Moiwa and Rusutsu rather than getting the bus.

And buy your tickets on the day. Online.

No hassle at the ticket window. No feeling like you've missed out because you've already committed to one resort, when a different one has had the goods.
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I can't thank Mike and Admin enough.

I love those hotel names Mike. That one hotel must have the longest name in the world Very Happy It took me a while to figure out. It looks like a good place and I certainly wouldn't have come across that on my own.

Admin: Wow, sounds like a great trip. £2500 for 4 weeks is truly unbelievable. I know it was years ago, but could you share the hotels or wherever you stayed?

4 wks of skiing is crazy. I better increase the the intensity and length of my workouts starting today. Booking the first few nights is a must after a long flight and arriving in a strange country. Thanks for reminding me and sharing the tip so others can benefit from it.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@skimachine Oh no sorry, I clearly wasn't clear Confused
The budget I described was just for the 2 weeks in Japan, but including flights from Europe.
It's just that I had 'warmed up' by doing 3 snowHeads bashes in a row, in Italy, prior to that. Hence, the 4 weeks being 3 weeks in Italy
It was also particularly convenient to start our flights to Sapporo from Milan as it was £260 cheaper than starting at London
straight through to another 1 in Japan and I really needed the rain to give me an excuse to sleep for a day so I could survive through the 2nd Japan week.
Then it was back to London to do the washing and sleep, for a week, before heading out to Italy again, then France for the Off Piste Bash.

That really was the best season I've ever had... but I was probably pushing myself a bit too hard at times. I have a bit of a vulnerability in my lower back and at one point it 'went out' but despite it always causing quite severe pain, I wasn't aware of it as I was aching so much all over, from skiing 10hrs straight at Niseko (they have lights, and treees - and it was chucking it down and -10C! So we couldn't stop snowHead ). I only realised when I found that beyond a certain steepness, I literally couldn't turn to the right without my left leg giving out Embarassed

I can't say I really know where I stayed: I left that mostly to @Harrison the Rabbit as he's good with last minute bookings - he practises a lot by booking onto the bashes after they're full rolling eyes @Sharkymark specialised in the driving because he was the only one smart enough to get the right bit of paper from the Post Office before leaving the UK. I mostly focussed on food related matters. I could show you a few very nice places to eat in Sapporo. One was so good, I truly couldn't believe it wasn't in the Michelin Guide - but it turned out we were just ahead of the game as it's in there now, with a star Little Angel That was quite expensive at about £100/head (although totally worth the price!!) but we felt we could afford it as the food had been so good and so much more affordable than we'd expected everywhere else. Niseko was the only place where we had to pay 'resort prices': everywhere else was a total bargain!

Am I right in thinking you'll be travelling from the States?
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@skimachine, Our return flights from Edinburgh to Japan last February would have cost us around £1500, we flew with Finnair as at the time of booking they were the only ones that would guarantee two pieces of luggage on the return journey, this was essential as we took our own skis.
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@admin, Two weeks including flights for £2500 is still great. Yes, from the USA...Boston. Actually tuning up to leave for skiing tonight.

I was wondering how to identify those good deals and last minute booking. I am quite used to driving in strong snow, but it can still be white knuckles for me.....just stay focused on the road and other cars, especially since I don't have 4-wheel drive, and stay calm.

@larry1950, Did you make it to Japan? That was about the time the COVID hit. Good point about the luggage. Thx for sharing. There are a few great flight deals out there to Japan now which I hope will hang around long enough that they will open up for February 2022 bookings.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@skimachine, Yes we had our holiday, arrived back in UK on 6th March in time for lockdown. We had no worries about Covid as it didn't really become a problem until just before we were due to fly home. Hope you and anyone else planning to go to Japan get there next year and have a fantastic time.
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@skimachine, @larry1950,

Not sure what the issue is with luggage - have flown Lufthansa, JAL and BA to Japan, they all had two pieces of bags and skis included. We had a booking with Air China LHR - PEK - CTS that I had picked up in August 2019 for £450 with luggage return, that go cancelled in Jan 2020 with Covid, rebooked onto JAL in Jan 2020 for FEB 2020 and got it for £480 though I suspect the demand for asia had slumped then so the low price.

friends flying on LOT from Warsaw also got two pieces of baggage and no questions askes about the ski bags - remember they told me the flight was basically empty.

My two observations:

Booking through skyscanner / expedia etc seem to offer different baggage allowances compared to booking direct with the airline

JAL has the best economy class in long-haul I have flown - worth the slight premium over BA
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@Harrison the Rabbit and I took a BA booking they were code sharing with JAL so we actually went one way on each. (I agree JAL was the better service, although BA was fine)
Milan=>LHR=>Haneda=>Sapporo
Sapporo=>Haneda=>LHR
Cost £420 rtn.
@Sharkymark did exactly the same route without the Milan=>LHR leg and it cost him £270 more Shocked
We booked through Skyscanner/Ebookers, we had no problems with luggage constraint (we all took skis/board) although the bags of Rabbit and myself took an extra 24hrs to arrive. This made Sharkymark happy because he got 24hrs gloating for only £270, which seemed like very good value at the time.

I was excited this year by the prospect of a new route: Milan=>Helsinki=>Sapporo, taking just 13hrs where the previous fastest route was 16.5hrs. Unfortunately, I did not manage to take advantage of that opportunity yet Confused
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Flew Helsinki-Sapporo last February, it is now my favourite way of getting to Hokkaido. Though have my eyes on Honshu for the next time.
Driving and freedom with a car are superb. When staying in Otaru a year ago there was a warmer spell of two days. So I decided to follow MikePow advice from 2018 about a place worth visiting - and off I went:

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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@extremerob, The flights were booked quite early and only Finnair had two bags on their quotes from Sapporo, all the others said we would get a price at the airport which we were not happy with, if we had booked later it might not have been a problem. We flew Edinburgh-London-Helsinki-Osaka returning Sapporo-Helsinki-London-Edinburgh.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
One thing that makes driving really easy is getting a Japanese sat-nav in the car.

You have absolutely 0% chance on entering a Japanese address....but don't worry!

You select your destination by its telephone number, and the nice girl takls to you in English.

It makes things so easy.

Another good thing is that the rental companies (which a mostly owned by a car manufacturer) rent according to zones, most of Hokkaido is one zone.
You can do a one-way rental without extra cost or hassle so long as it is within the same zone, and even change drop-off during the rental period.

W collected in Niseko and delivered in Sapporo for example.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Wow, those flights are dirt cheap compared to anything you could get to Japan pre-covid from here. Yes, usually 2 bags free, but worth confirming.

I have heard about those Sat-nav girls. Very Happy

Maybe my play will be fly into Asahikawa and out of Sapporo or vice versa. Haven't worried about that yet.

Right now it is just me. I am really just planning now so I can sell the idea to some buddies. Of course it is a hard sell with the two week travel period, long flight, cost, etc. You know in the USA we don't get much holiday time so to use so much early in the year is a big ask. The sell to those with wives and kids is tough, a bit easier to those with gf. It is certainly an easier sell to my single buddies. Hopefully the pent up demand from this year will help.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@skimachine, if you have some flexibility keep Myoko and Hakuba on your radar. I went to Japan targeting Hokkaido last year (that I had previously visited in 2014). But due to a low snow period conditions were a lot better on Honshu and IMO the terrain (in Happo One) was more Interesting. Pics here:
https://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?p=3527968
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Just been quoted £1049 rtn to Sapporo from London with BA, and that seems to be a good price. Only one bag. How did people get the low prices mentioned above?
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@vaughan, last I looked there wasn't much showing up for next Feb yet.
But here is an example in October, for demonstration purposes snowHead
JAL: Milan => Sapporo => London for just over £600
https://www.skyscanner.net/transport/d/mila/2021-10-09/spka/spka/2021-10-31/lond/?adults=1&adultsv2=1&cabinclass=economy&children=0&childrenv2=&infants=0&ref=home
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Actually, here's something similar for January, so a bit closer Wink
https://www.skyscanner.net/transport/d/mila/2022-01-09/spka/spka/2022-01-22/lond/?adults=1&adultsv2=1&cabinclass=economy&children=0&childrenv2=&departure-times=0-1439&duration=2070&infants=0&ref=home
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Just realised that this is a flexible ticket that includes cancellation due to COVID.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
vaughan wrote:
Just realised that this is a flexible ticket that includes cancellation due to COVID.


Yeah expensive.

Better options out there than BA.

Wait until you get the 100% guarantee that Japan is receiving tourists.

I've flown for as low as £450 return (Birmingham-Osaka-Chitose) and as high as £900 (all routes).
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skimachine wrote:
@admin, Yes, from the USA...Boston. Actually tuning up to leave for skiing tonight.


Enjoy it, you lucky barsteward! Toofy Grin Where are you heading?

Reading Snowheads and drooling over last season's ski photos is as close as we can get to the sport this season Sad
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
vaughan wrote:
Just realised that this is a flexible ticket that includes cancellation due to COVID.


Be really careful with that. It may say if you change the ticket you have to pay the difference in tariff, but don't need to pay the change fee, that the cancellation is only good until a certain date...March 31, 2021, or free change until a certain date regardless of current tariff.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
admin wrote:
@vaughan, last I looked there wasn't much showing up for next Feb yet.
But here is an example in October, for demonstration purposes snowHead
JAL: Milan => Sapporo => London for just over £600
https://www.skyscanner.net/transport/d/mila/2021-10-09/spka/spka/2021-10-31/lond/?adults=1&adultsv2=1&cabinclass=economy&children=0&childrenv2=&infants=0&ref=home


Agreed. Rarely do airlines post flights more than 11 months in advance.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Bergmeister wrote:
skimachine wrote:
@admin, Yes, from the USA...Boston. Actually tuning up to leave for skiing tonight.


Enjoy it, you lucky barsteward! Toofy Grin Where are you heading?

Reading Snowheads and drooling over last season's ski photos is as close as we can get to the sport this season Sad


I hope you OD on the photos and videos.

Sugarloaf last weekend (3-days skiing), Sunday River the previous weekend (3-days skiing), Loon and possibly Waterville Valley this weekend....rained 1 com or so Monday and then icy cold and crazy windy yesterday so not so sure about the conditions. Sorry to rub it in.
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