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DPS Phantom 2.0 base treatment

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Got sent a packet of this to evaluate over this season....
Basically a wax replacement which soaks into the pores of the P-tex base material and can be serviced/gound with no detriment.
The claim is that it lasts for the life of the ski and you'll never need to wax again, cost is €100, but that's only 10 or so waxes, so if the claims are true, then it's a no-brainer....
Also, there's always those times when you wished you'd waxed your skis, or got the wrong wax on, this should go away with Phantom Glide, plus wax only lasts a few days, so really needs doing twice weekly.
Comes as a 2-part mix which has to be applied then cured by UV, either in the sun like I did in August, or in a special sun-bed type gismo.
Easy enough to apply, have been waiting 4 months to try it out!!!

Link here to original review and my application of the PG:

https://www.stylealtitude.com/phantom-wax-dps.html

Fast forward to this season:
So far I've skied around 15 days on the PG, applied to DPS Wailer 112's (what else Very Happy ) and have found the treatment to work as good as waxed skis in temps varying from -5 to +4, it works the same on all types of snow and is as fast as anybody else's skis out there....
One thing I've noticed is when you're stood in a lift queue, normally with freshly waxed skis, they slide back n forth all the time, with PG they're kind of stuck a little, which is no bad thing, but within a metre or 2 of skiing, it's business as usual....
Something else I've noticed is the bases after 15 days still have that "juste waxed" sheen to them, which bodes well!
So far, very positive impressions for the treatment, my remit is to see if the longevity is indeed as claimed by DPS,
watch this space............


Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Thu 26-12-19 18:53; edited 2 times in total
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Interesting. How do the skis run when you get off a chair lift? Would not want any stickage then.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@cad99uk, not at all noticeable there! Just a slight feeling of "stickiness" in the lift line, and "I hope they run better than this", which indeed they do! It's literally for a metre or so and has been reported online by other testers.......
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@KenX, Thanks. Reason I ask: first uplift of the season my snowboard went through the plume of a snowblower. Came to get off, stand up and glide away. No, rooted to the spot, could not even scoot, so wiped out by the chair.

The bottom of the board was coated with ice crystals. Obviously an extreme case but made me realise how necessary it is to be able to glide away.

Keep us updated.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@cad99uk, if skis/board are freshly waxed, that wouldn't happen, which obviously isn't the case 95% of the time, another plus for PG I guess!
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Curious what happens if it turns out not to work. Will you still be able to wax the skis after?
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
To test it properly surely you would need to treat just one ski so that you have a control samlpe Madeye-Smiley
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@adithorp, you can wax over it if conditions warrant, ie maybe very "sharp", hard snow, or perhaps super-warm wet snow without any problems, I'll be testing all variants and possibilities this season!
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anarchicsaltire wrote:
To test it properly surely you would need to treat just one ski so that you have a control samlpe Madeye-Smiley


Of course I'm doing that.................................
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Does it affect how well skins stick?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
I've got factory applied Phantom Glide on my new PW RP100's and although I haven't had them on snow yet, I didn't notice any difference when applying the skins to cut them. Since the PG product is chemically bonded to the base, there should be no contamination transferred to the skin glue.

I don't know if the various glue-less skins would be effected.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@betterinblack, my skins stick just fine Very Happy
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
You going to do some A/B testing using a scientific method?

The biggest thing I dislike about DPS Phantom ( aside from a suspicion that it is just Juice with better marketing) is the lack of published scientific blind testing to support their claims. That plus the fact that last year they basically were charging people $100 to act as beta testers.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@Dave of the Marmottes, don’t feel the need to do scientific A/B testing, I feel I have enough ski miles under my belt to tell if a ski is gliding as it should under varying conditions and to see if it’s still the same at the end of the season, I’ll leave all that stuff to the likes of Blister, TGR etc etc........
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Well, another few weeks (and tours) under the Phantom's belt, still going strong, maybe not quite as fast as a perfectly waxed ski, but pretty damn close.....
And of course, none of the attendant wax fiddling and guesswork!
The bases still have a nice satin black finish to them, even after 20 or so days skiing on them.
Skins sticking well under all conditions, today was a very dry, -13 degree day and they were on and off like a champ Very Happy
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
41 pages on DPS Phantom at Pugski:

https://www.pugski.com/threads/review-dps-phantom-permanent-base-glide-treatment.7690/
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@Fish_Head, what was the verdict?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
BobinCH wrote:
@Fish_Head, what was the verdict?


I only read a couple of the last pages - feedback appears generally good
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Having read the reviews I'm a tempted to treat my new skis to this treatment. A quick Google doesn't give many options to purchase, any recommendations for supply please?
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
https://www.snowcountry.fr/dps-phantom-package.html?___store=snc_fr&gclid=Cj0KCQiAvJXxBRCeARIsAMSkApoURjsHH6IYszmdaI4UqXkhprh491bT85IIvx5hkzGDtNIWBaWwUgoaAsEAEALw_wcB
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I was hoping someone would do a real world test, sounds very promising! I guess the ultimate test is how it lasts next season, after being stored for the summer?
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
I’ve just had my first couple of days on DPS factory applied Phantom. The first day was at an air temperature of between -10C and -18C, and apart from feeling sticky when skiing through a snow making plume (I’ve never had a ski that didn’t), they didn’t feel any different to well waxed skis. The second day I was skinning and there were no problems getting the skins to stick, or with them staying put.

As mentioned the test will be how long the performance stays the same.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
kitenski wrote:
I was hoping someone would do a real world test, sounds very promising! I guess the ultimate test is how it lasts next season, after being stored for the summer?

I applied the Phantom 2.0 last summer, they've been in the loft since then, so ok I guess Very Happy
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
I'm tempted to go all-out and use this stuff on three sets of skis: thoughts? I'm assuming it doesn't have to be DPS skis only, it just bonds to normal p-tex doesn't it?

From what I've read it's not as good as a proper, fresh wax but it lasts for the life of a ski so saves money and/or time?
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It's fine to use Phantom on all skis, P-Tex is P-Tex...........
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A regular Chamonix based ski chum bought brand new skis with the treatment applied by the retailer last summer. It has worked admirably for him. However, the retailer learned the hard way that the treatment isn't perfect.

On application to a new ski with light coloured base (as opposed to black) it resulted in skis which stubbornly refused to slide! Full refund/replacement for the customer. They only apply to black bases now.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
HammondR wrote:

On application to a new ski with light coloured base (as opposed to black) it resulted in skis which stubbornly refused to slide! Full refund/replacement for the customer. They only apply to black bases now.


How interesting, I assume then the bases when coloured are very different make-up or material to the normal black PTEX not just from a different a masterbatch dose, what are they?
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Do Whitedot owners go round in circles if they use this base treatment ?
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@rjs, you joke, but what @HammondR says makes me wonder.

We did demo the Juice product a few years ago. TBH we weren't that impressed, and were somewhat put off by the manufacturer inability to explain how it worked, or how it would resist the effects of a base grind.
BUT
As either ski out of a pair of Whitedots from that year would have a had a decent amount of white base then maybe that explains why the results were not great.

Or maybe not.

*edited once to make it clear we tested Juice, which may (or may not) be the same product.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I’ll try and contact DPS and get the lowdown on this.......
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Hmmmm something of an equivocal response. I spoke to a ski shop and the tech wasn't thrilled either. I did see that one retailer/rental shop had coated all their skis in the stuff but if it was so good wouldn't everyone smash it on and save themselves a fortune in time and money? I'm not quite convinced...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I'm really happy with mine (on black bases), but the €100 initial outlay could well be the reason more people don't jump at it? Waiting for my contact at DPS to get back to me......
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
I’m happy with mine - phantomed by factory. I did over 30 days on Wailer 110s 18/19 and 6 days 2020: noticed no performance difference and still gliding nicely.

Early on, I did pick up a nasty gouge which I filled with ptex, I have not waxed that area so it clearly lacks any treatment.

I rather enjoy servicing my own skis and sort of missed not waxing the Phantom’ed pair. Once I almost waxed them in error when having a waxing session.

Hard to choose between freshly waxed or Phantom’ed but I’d certainly rather the factory did the fiddly Phantoming.

If it’s Phantom’ed, I’d be happy to ski it but hard to pick one over the other.
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midgetbiker wrote:
@rjs, you joke, but what @HammondR says makes me wonder.

We did demo the Juice product a few years ago. TBH we weren't that impressed, and were somewhat put off by the manufacturer inability to explain how it worked, or how it would resist the effects of a base grind.


*edited once to make it clear we tested Juice, which may (or may not) be the same product.


Indeed the lack of disclosure on whether it is or isn't Juice 2.0 is one of my problems with DPS's emperor's new clothes things. That and the lack of double blind data for something with wooscience magiconium marketing. Punters who shell out $100 per dose sure believe it works though, wonder if they'd feel the same at $20?
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Just spoke to my chum. It was No1 Sport in Verbier that had the problem with light coloured bases. Funnily enough, he has an acquaintance at Au Vieux Campeur in Sallanches who also have experience with the oofle dust. Turns out they had no similar problems. Figure that one out.
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Don’t mind if it’s Juice or Phantom, I’m satisfied that it works and will notice when it doesn’t (and advise)
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"Hey Ken,

Sorry for the slow response here as I've been hunkering down in New Hampshire while we try to wait out Covid.

Abrasion leading to micro-hairs will result in poor glide performance on a ski base, simple as that. Since PHANTOM does not protect against abrasion and lower quality bases suffer from abrasion more quickly (and severely), the maintenance demands (i.e. polishing) on lower quality bases is much higher. If/when a base is unable to be restored to a matte black polished state by using a polishing pad, this is a sign that the base likely needs to be stone ground.

When bases are clear or colored, it can be hard to recognise visual tell-tales. This has an effect during the PHANTOM finishing process where it is more difficult to identify if all of the PHANTOM residue has been removed, and so we recommend additional diligence to ensure it has. When skis/snowboards are in normal use it is also harder to identify the build up of micro-hairs. Look out for the base 'dulling', feeling furry, or glide slowing. If any of these is present give the base a thorough polish.

So basically PHANTOM does work with lower grade and coloured bases, it just requires more attention to detail during application, and during use to ensure maintenance/polishing is done when needed. I hope all that information helps! Please let me know if you have any other questions.

Cheers!
Conor"
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I've read this thread with interest and have decided to buy some Phantom wax. It's due to arrive soon and I will let you know how fiddly or otherwise the process is. It's not going to be really sunny and hot for a while though so it may be some days/weeks before I can do it. The skis I'm going to use will have black bases, by the way.
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