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Bad news from Solden.

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead

http://youtube.com/v/MF8mbm7wWnU
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Sadly two people lost their lives today while riding in Sölden, Austria.

The two riders who are thought to have been snowboarders were riding off-piste above the blue piste number 33 which leads down to the Sölden stadium. The avalanche came over the piste #33 and search and rescue where soon on the scene. After a short time, it looked like the riders did not have off-piste equipment with them as no transceiver signal could be found so a manual probe search began. Unfortunately, this is a slow process and the search did not find the people in time and both riders were found to be dead when dugout.

High winds and heavy snowfall across many parts of Austria this weekend have increased the likelihood of an avalanche. Only yesterday the access road to the glacial ski area in Sölden was closed for several hours due to the risk of avalanches.

We send our condolences to the families of the riders who lost their lives today in this tragedy.


http://youtube.com/v/MF8mbm7wWnU
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad
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 You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
Ouch.

Heavy snow on warm ground = deathzone.

Not far from where 2 US skiteam members were avalanched in Jan 2015.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Is obviously a dodgy roll-over there.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
According to the following article, it turns out that the victims (33, and 39, both Dutch) did have functioning beepers on; and both had airbags - though it doesn't say whether they were inflated. Tragically, their final location underneath 4 metres of snow and next to the rock wall apparently meant that the signal didn't reach the outside Shocked. I didn't realize that that was a thing. RIP.

https://www.nevasport.com/noticias/art/57945/dos-muertos-en-un-alud-en-solden-pese-a-que-llevaban-sistemas-de-seguridad/
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Pyremaniac wrote:
According to the following article, it turns out that the victims (33, and 39, both Dutch) did have functioning beepers on; and both had airbags - though it doesn't say whether they were inflated. Tragically, their final location underneath 4 metres of snow and next to the rock wall apparently meant that the signal didn't reach the outside Shocked. I didn't realize that that was a thing. RIP.

https://www.nevasport.com/noticias/art/57945/dos-muertos-en-un-alud-en-solden-pese-a-que-llevaban-sistemas-de-seguridad/


Terrain traps lethal in so many ways - that's a shocker
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@Pyremaniac, one of them did inflate his bag. I guess they just got caught in a terrain trap where an airbag is not going to help. The report in ORF says they were found under 2.5 to 3.5 meters snow.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@Steilhang,
It is not just ‘terrain traps’
There are already many more avalanche casualties with airbag.
The 4 Germans in Lech last winter had airbags too.
The director of the Lech Skilifts later reported that going the route they went was equal to suicide at that moment. And that airbags never were going to help there and then

We need to worry about airbags causing too much confidence...
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Langerzug wrote:
@Steilhang,
It is not just ‘terrain traps’
There are already many more avalanche casualties with airbag.
The 4 Germans in Lech last winter had airbags too.
The director of the Lech Skilifts later reported that going the route they went was equal to suicide at that moment. And that airbags never were going to help there and then

We need to worry about airbags causing too much confidence...

I agree that airbags are now being seen as the equivalent of a parachute that will save you, rather than the truth that they will (may?) increase your survival rate in open field fast flowing avalanches. As mentioned cliff's, trees or terrain traps negate airbags.

Another issue is the YouTube generation who film everything, for whom getting that next video negates the requirement for maintaining separation and escape routes. On my last guided trip instructions along the lines of count for 15 seconds or wait until they reach the treeline was repeatedly ignored to video the person ahead. Even to the extent of proudly showing the video clip to the guide at the end of the day Shocked
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
PowderAdict wrote:
Langerzug wrote:
@Steilhang,
It is not just ‘terrain traps’
There are already many more avalanche casualties with airbag.
The 4 Germans in Lech last winter had airbags too.
The director of the Lech Skilifts later reported that going the route they went was equal to suicide at that moment. And that airbags never were going to help there and then

We need to worry about airbags causing too much confidence...

I agree that airbags are now being seen as the equivalent of a parachute that will save you, rather than the truth that they will (may?) increase your survival rate in open field fast flowing avalanches. As mentioned cliff's, trees or terrain traps negate airbags.

Another issue is the YouTube generation who film everything, for whom getting that next video negates the requirement for maintaining separation and escape routes. On my last guided trip instructions along the lines of count for 15 seconds or wait until they reach the treeline was repeatedly ignored to video the person ahead. Even to the extent of proudly showing the video clip to the guide at the end of the day Shocked


Interesting you mention parachutes and overconfidence from safety devices.
Years ago there was an article about how the parachuting fatality rate only blipped when automatic deployment devices became mandatory before returning to its previous level.
it was suspected the ADDs were nudging people to try more riskier stuff with a commensurate increase in fatal failures

If my google fu is up to it, I'll try and search it out
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
PowderAdict wrote:
Langerzug wrote:
@Steilhang,
It is not just ‘terrain traps’
There are already many more avalanche casualties with airbag.
The 4 Germans in Lech last winter had airbags too.
The director of the Lech Skilifts later reported that going the route they went was equal to suicide at that moment. And that airbags never were going to help there and then

We need to worry about airbags causing too much confidence...

I agree that airbags are now being seen as the equivalent of a parachute that will save you, rather than the truth that they will (may?) increase your survival rate in open field fast flowing avalanches. As mentioned cliffs, trees or terrain traps negate airbags.

They definitely do. I heard a story last season from one of the participants about a group of about six skiers and snowboarders, somewhere in Tirol. They skied together for a while, before some bright spark decided to take a riskier route. “Too bad you can’t come with us,” she said to the half of the group without airbags, and before they could argue, were gone. There are several things going wrong here, but one is the feeling of invincibility when carrying the airbag. Luckily, nothing happened.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@Scarlet, yep. As mentioned above, the only situation they help in is fast flowing slides with loose snow, no trees, no rocks, no cliffs. As soon as you are standing the only use they may be is for creating airspaces if you get covered by a following slide.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Anyone beeing up on Rettenbach in Soelden knows where is this, and also know it's really bad idea (mildly said) to go crossing slope under Icebox. If avalanche doesn't swipe you down, you have plenty of chances to disappear in one of numerous crevasses running all over that slope.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
More here. Including picture of slide from above.

https://www.planetski.eu/news/12248
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Very sad for all families and friends really feel for the partner what a terrible time .
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
It seems they were very experienced folks. One has to conclude that something went badly wrong with the decision-making. Very sad indeed.

[That article also provides some updates to stuff said earlier: one of the airbags was triggered; and the burials were under 3 metres of snow.]
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