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Has the 10,000 hour rule created a generation of pushy parents?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
More silly season nonsense

If you want to be good at something, generalize don't specialize claims book

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2019/may/27/sports-variety-better-early-than-sharp-focus-david-epstein-book

I think we call it cross-training. For example my local ski de fond club has the kids playing football, frisbee and mountain biking but those skills still apply to cross country in terms of balance and coordination so adding to the 10,000 hours. In short, there are different routes to greatness but they all involve putting the time in so I'm not sure this disproves the overall rule. They would also be part of the "deliberate practise" hours. Of course all work and no play makes Jill a dull non gender specific person.

Another example, a great coder can probably program in a number of languages and using say OOP, Procedural and Functional languages will make the mind more flexible and able to spot good approaches to problem solving.

see also: https://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=75059 (@andyph makes a similar comment)
and https://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=137564

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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@davidof, It can be difficult to get the "deliberate practice" bit right.

Where I mostly ski is easy enough to drive to for a couple of valley ski clubs to get there on Wednesday afternoons and weekends. I get to compare what they are doing with how the local club trains their kids, there are big differences. Have a guess which group produces national team members. Local kids probably ski another couple of afternoons each week.
snow conditions     
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
The SCGB skiing levels (Red, Silver, Purple, Gold+, Gold ++ etc) are clearly missing from your chart.
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 You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
Naturally sporty people tend to be good at all sports.

Balance, coordination, core strength, speed, spatial awareness, etc. apply to pretty much all sports.

It is more like the "20,000 hours" rule.

Do several thousand hours in 5 to 10 disciplines from 2-16yo, and then specialize in 1 sport for 10k hours from (say) 11-40yo.

Above all, don't peak too early.

Elite children at 14 rarely become elite adults at 24 or 34.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@Whitegold,
agree with most of that but not true of all sports

Think most top tennis players were elite at 14 - probably because it is such a technical sport. Nadal, Djokovich and Murray were emerging as the best at around age 12 I think
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 You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
Just because someone spends 10,000 hours doing something, does not mean they will be good at it.

There still needs to be the ability, technique & Physique, other attributes as well as a whole load of luck. You could have someone 5ft 6, run 100m in 10 seconds & hands like velcro. He still wont make the cut in the NFL because of his height.

I have seen good footballers with the right attributes who have flushed their careers because they did not have the right attitude.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Mr.Egg wrote:
Just because someone spends 10,000 hours doing something, does not mean they will be good at it.

This +1.
Before retirement I had staff who would berate me whenever I tried to change anything with "I've been doing this job for 20 years..". My response was usually "are you sure you haven't been doing the job for 1 year twenty times?"
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
MikeM wrote:
Mr.Egg wrote:
Just because someone spends 10,000 hours doing something, does not mean they will be good at it.

This +1.
Before retirement I had staff who would berate me whenever I tried to change anything with "I've been doing this job for 20 years..". My response was usually "are you sure you haven't been doing the job for 1 year twenty times?"


That neatly summarises the recreational skier
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Quote:

That neatly summarises the recreational skier


Absolutely no doubt. The idea of progressing based on 6 days practice per year is farcial. I feel I'm going backwards at 7x that (maybe I need a full season to reboot).
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
There are valid points on both sides of the argument.

There has to be a combination of physical suitability + structured, hard work + commitment + desire + luck (avoiding injuries / capitalising on others' injuries) to name just 5 factors.

If I compare my childhood and my brother's childhood with the childhood of my nephew (10 year old, my brother's son), my nephew is exploring as many sports as we did - either in school or playing for a team outside of school - often having more structured coaching.

The big differences are

We walked or ran everywhere, my nephew gets driven
We played significantly more unstructured games than he does
We played against older brothers and friends, my nephew only plays with and against children within 1 year of his age
We played on any and every surface in all weathers, my nephew plays pretty much on great surfaces in good weather

In skiing terms, my brother and I went off-piste in all conditions at an early age and my nephew skis groomed runs in the sunshine.
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@Mike Pow, +1 for the big differences.

As kids (11 years onwards), my friends and I used to play football every Sunday afternoon with the local men, many of whom had just poured out of the local pubs/club; some the worse for wear and many who would think nothing of hacking down or kicking lumps out any precocious kid who had the audacity to make them look stupid. We often used to play on the beach, were it could be 20+ a side and the goals (jumpers or stones) were nearly 200 yards apart.

In the summer holidays or at weekends, I’d sometimes leave the house in the morning and my parents wouldn’t see me until tea time. We could be up in the mountains behind the town making dens, in the woods playing, or fishing up a trout river 5 miles away, having cycled there via the main road into town. We’d move up the river by scrambling over moss covered rocks, from pool to pool. We’d walk across large fallen trees bridging the river above a large waterfall and think nothing of it. With no adult in sight. In hindsight, it really was an idyllic childhood.
ski holidays     
 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I feel that the 10,000 hours thing is correct, because it reflects my own experience. I've seen many professional athletes struggle with the basics of snowboarding and surfing: so to me assuming you want to learn, it's the hours not the "aptitude". I've noticed that professional surfers rarely reach "mastery" of snowboarding. I say "rarely" because I've not seen any, but I'm sure some do. Most get very good, but you can still see the joins.

As far as programming, I don't think that's a useful analogy. Any competent programmer can program in anything. Many have strong preferences given specific problem parameters, but really it's not an issue. I never recruited people because they had experience in a language we were using, I just recruited very smart programmers. If they didn't already know the language, they'd relish learning something knew. If a candidate doesn't have the confidence and attitude for that, they're not for me. An exception is contractors, but that's a different

I do a fair number of sports, but I think the difference is more significant than the difference between programming languages. I don't have to spend 10,000 hours picking up a new language.

To me old age is that mindset when you forget how when you were a kid,
all the old people would whine on about how great things were when they were kids.
If you can't see the pattern you're doomed to repeat it.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Awdbugga wrote:
@Mike Pow, +1 for the big differences.

As kids (11 years onwards), my friends and I used to play football every Sunday afternoon with the local men, many of whom had just poured out of the local pubs/club; some the worse for wear and many who would think nothing of hacking down or kicking lumps out any precocious kid who had the audacity to make them look stupid. We often used to play on the beach, were it could be 20+ a side and the goals (jumpers or stones) were nearly 200 yards apart.

In the summer holidays or at weekends, I’d sometimes leave the house in the morning and my parents wouldn’t see me until tea time. We could be up in the mountains behind the town making dens, in the woods playing, or fishing up a trout river 5 miles away, having cycled there via the main road into town. We’d move up the river by scrambling over moss covered rocks, from pool to pool. We’d walk across large fallen trees bridging the river above a large waterfall and think nothing of it. With no adult in sight. In hindsight, it really was an idyllic childhood.


It was the same down south, just without the nasal tone Wink
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@Mike Pow, behave butty boy. Toofy Grin wink
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Awdbugga wrote:
@Mike Pow, behave butty boy. Toofy Grin wink


Laughing Laughing
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