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Keeping shin against boot on a turn

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I had a lesson today which made me a bit grumpy as while I thought I was getting better, I still have a tendency to move backwards in a turn, and lean too much into the slope.

My thinking is that leaning out of the slope is more about the courage to do so. However, getting forward is really difficult. If I'm stationary, I know how to get forward on my boots, but when I move, the skis slip down the hill and so I move backwards. Does anyone have a good tip on how to stay forward. Telling me to get forward doesn't seem to work.

Thanks
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:

the skis slip down the hill and so I move backwards


As you're coming out of the turn? If so, try a double pole plant far forward. Really reach forward. Works a treat for mid/long turns.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
It's almost as soon as I start - as the skis accelerate, they move faster than my body which moves back, and I stay like that for the rest of the turn
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Depends on the turns but I find that keeping my hands where I can see them is a big help. One of the main reasons I pole plant is to remind myself to keep weight forward.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@mh8782, Sounds like you could be too upright. Bend ze ankles. Posting a vid would help.
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AL9000 wrote:
@mh8782, Sounds like you could be too upright. Bend ze ankles. Posting a vid would help.


That’s my main problem too. Any tips on how to do this? Is it simply a case of trying to thrust the knees forward or sitting down with the weight forward?
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@Austrian Seagull, Don't 'sit'!!
Bend ze ankles more and/or think 'knees ahead of toes' as you're skiing with arms up.

Makes a world of difference....you'll lurrrve it snowHead
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Not an instructor, just personal experience...

1. Check boot fit isn't hampering you. For me, sloppy cuff, wrong forward lean, sloppy foot hold, sloppy ankle hold have all been issues.
2. Forward lean and weight forward comes from ankle flex as much as knee and thing bend.
3. Relax. Everything. Especially hip front creases.
4. Stick both hands out in front, arms pretty straight, fists visible - and keep them there at all times, even when pole planting. Make sure you start off like this. This is the one thing which makes a huge difference to me when I start getting back weighted. Oh, and look forward and where you're going, not at the snow.
5. Weight through somewhere between ball of foot, bunions and arch. Keep it there from the start.
6. Depends what leaning into the slope means. My ski control got a lot better when I learnt to do that (with hips).
7. You have to commit to going down the fall line. Leaning away from the slope is instinctive, but wrong for skiing (and boarding). You gave to get your weight forward, your 'drive' forward, and then trust in the ski weighting and turn to save you (which it does very surprisingly and easily once it comes together, even on scarily-steep slopes). That requires your stance to he balanced and stacked, your weight to be through your feet in the right place (see above) and your hands and upper body forward (see above). And a tad of bottle...

You'll get it, bit by bit (I'm still nowhere near perfect). There's a lit about his your hips or centre of mass move when you pressure and unpressured skis, change weighted ski etc - I had a right phase with this a couple of years ago, eventually found some YT vids that made some sense, eventually found a feel that made sense to me (plus new boots).

Good luck (and I will now duck and run away).
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Thanks, I'm going to try a few of those things out tomorrow (a long weekend in Switzerland)
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1. Keeping hands forward (in your vision), is an excellent suggestion.
2. Rather than thinking of getting forward, try pulling your feet back under hips, especially at the start of the turn.
3. Try pulling your toes up (inside your boots) for a few turns, as this presses knee forward.
4. This video can be helpful:


http://youtube.com/v/1k4c87HEOAQ
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@mh8782, did the instructor not give you some things to work on tomorrow as part of the lesson??

It could also be that some fundamental basics of the turn aren't dialled in yet, some video would really help the analysis!

You could try (on an easy slope)

Balancing your poles across your wrists and make sure you can see them, if you lean back they'll roll back off your wrists or fall off. Can make it more fun by putting a snow ball on top of the poles Smile

One a gentle slope try lifing the tail of the inside ski during the turn and keep the tip pressed on the snow. If the tip lifts you are leaning back. I've no idea of your standard so this maybe too difficult.

On arm position don't have them stuck straight out, think holding a tray of drinks and not wanting to spill any....so the tray would be in your view thoughout the turn.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I'd suggest focusing on what you are trying to achieve, rather than the move to get there. Think "Centered and balanced".

Moving forward isn't an end in it's self, rather something which will help you achieve the desired end result. Developing your Proprioception (generally) in terms of your fore\aft balance will help you know what adjustments to make.
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Old Fartbag wrote:
2. Rather than thinking of getting forward, try pulling your feet back under hips, especially at the start of the turn.


I was going to suggest this too - thinking of the same thing in a different way sometimes makes a huge difference. So don't worry about moving your body forwards - pull your feet back instead.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@Old Fartbag, that's a vid I was going to recommend to the OP. You linked it up for me a couple of years ago regarding a back weighting problem, and it kind of helped, and still makes me think about things in a helpful way (so thanks).
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Grizzler wrote:
@Old Fartbag, that's a vid I was going to recommend to the OP. You linked it up for me a couple of years ago regarding a back weighting problem, and it kind of helped, and still makes me think about things in a helpful way (so thanks).

Glad it made a difference....it's also something that has helped me.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Tom Doc wrote:
Old Fartbag wrote:
2. Rather than thinking of getting forward, try pulling your feet back under hips, especially at the start of the turn.


I was going to suggest this too - thinking of the same thing in a different way sometimes makes a huge difference. So don't worry about moving your body forwards - pull your feet back instead.


This!

Just this!

It really is the magic cure for so many ski posture issues.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
rungsp wrote:
Tom Doc wrote:
Old Fartbag wrote:
2. Rather than thinking of getting forward, try pulling your feet back under hips, especially at the start of the turn.


I was going to suggest this too - thinking of the same thing in a different way sometimes makes a huge difference. So don't worry about moving your body forwards - pull your feet back instead.


This!

Just this!

It really is the magic cure for so many ski posture issues.


Ditto
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Plus 1 for just pull your feet backwards. It is easier to focus on 1 thing at a time rather than several.
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I had same issue until last week, and in the end it wasn't thinking about the front of my boots that helped, it was learning how to fall hips-first down the hill that stopped any backseat issues.

Two things I found helpful (in combination with each other):

1. Lots and lots and LOTS of braquage, with a real big focus on putting weight on the ski pole (for the first 3 quarters of the way through the turn), bringing the other hand up and forward for balance, and allowing myself to fall, hips-first, down the hill. Lets you fall down the hill with the safety of being supported by the pole - helps with the mental block

2. Something stupid like 500 reps of this dry land exercise (in one night!!), found at 5b, which taught me the feeling of my hips falling away, which you then take into the braquage to make it more effective: http://www.warrensmith-skiacademy.com/tutorial/ski-biomechanics-range-tests/

Then whenever I found myself leaning back away from the hill, would stop and do some braquage to remind myself what it's meant to feel like! Was also a good way to fill time while waiting for my slow-ass snowboarding boyfriend to catch up...
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
What is bracquage? And what does it mean hips down the slope? I thought they were meant to be upslope so you create a C and some grip
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mh8782 wrote:
What is bracquage?


It's an exercise aimed at teaching you to pivot your skis quickly.


http://youtube.com/v/_BoHnTFZHL0
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@kitenski, ugh, don't remind me. A whole DAY of it on a Warren Smith course in Hemel. I have never been so bored, or so cold.
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Hurtle wrote:
@kitenski, ugh, don't remind me. A whole DAY of it on a Warren Smith course in Hemel. I have never been so bored, or so cold.


Ha ha, I had a similiar experience!
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Get in centred position whilst standing still. Knees slightly bent and arms forward. Tie string around each knee and other attach ends to ski tips. Tie string around your wrists and attach other end to ski tips. Loop string through front vent in your helmet and attach to ski tips ...Take out all slack in string and get friend to push you downhill. let me know how you get on .. (disc : not an instructor ) Toofy Grin


Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Sat 16-02-19 19:36; edited 1 time in total
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limegreen1 wrote:
Get in centred position whilst standing still. Knees slightly bent and arms forward. Tie string around each knee and other attach ends to ski tips. Tie string around your wrists and attach other end to ski tips. Loop string through front vent in your helmet and attach to ski tips ...Take out all slack in string and get friend to push you downhill. let me know how you get on .. (disc : not an instructor )
Please ask the friend to video this Laughing
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I did have an instructor clip each of my wrists to either end of a pole last year, which didn't in fact end in the disaster which I had predicted! Shocked
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@mh8782, you're probably back now, but doing a little two footed vertical jump is a good way of checking that you're well balanced and that your weight is forward.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@motyl, I had a UK instructor 'tie' my hands to my poles whilst they were behind my back, horizontally across my waist. Very disconcerting, worrying if I fell - but actually really worked for what he was trying to convey.

@Ray Zorro, yes, I had this on a recent lesson. Traverse, jump, turn, jump. He said that I wouldn't have been able to do it if my weighting (and, I assume, recovery) wasn't right. So there's hope for me yet... Laughing
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I find trying to grip the top of my boot with my toes (if that makes sense) helps get me in the front of the boot.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Warren Smith and bracquage....aargh - spent almost 1/2 a day at CFe with one of his clones, at one of his workshops about 5 years ago - boring but it works, that and keeping your arms out front with strong pole plant.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Deb Armstrong - Fantastic Instructor (specialising in teaching kids!); Annoying voice.

This plays to what has been talked about above - Stroke the Ski and Wake up the ankles:


http://youtube.com/v/XgctOD6OkZk
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Practise starting the turn slowly....reeeeallyy slowly, be conscious that you are picking up a lot of speed as you hit the fall line, don't be afraid of this, and THEN scrub off any speed you need in the 2nd half of the turn.
I worked on this recently and somehow it just got my weight in the right place.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Old Fartbag wrote:
Deb Armstrong - Fantastic Instructor (specialising in teaching kids!); Annoying voice.



Olympic Gold though
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Dave of the Marmottes wrote:
Old Fartbag wrote:
Deb Armstrong - Fantastic Instructor (specialising in teaching kids!); Annoying voice.



Olympic Gold though

Clear, Authentic and Passionate....that's what really matters.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Slightly diverging from the original topic - I have shown her YouTube video teaching U10's to ski powder to a number of people who used the techniques to great effect on their first few forays in the soft stuff
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@oui4ski, link pls
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
AL9000 wrote:
@oui4ski, link pls

This is probably it:


Deb Armstrong Powder skiing Clinic from Beauregard, Steamboat Aerials
https://vimeo.com/120752975
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Old Fartbag wrote:
Deb Armstrong - Fantastic Instructor (specialising in teaching kids!); Annoying voice.

This plays to what has been talked about above - Stroke the Ski and Wake up the ankles:


http://youtube.com/v/XgctOD6OkZk


Idiot question probably - but when the experts are making videos focused on subtleties, such as ankle turn in this case, why are they still wearing baggy duds that obsure what is going on in that area? All I see is an overall balanced person.

Edit: I'm watching it on my phone.
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@Scamper, because it'd be feckin cold in shorts! A good instructor can tell how much ankle/knee/hip flex you are using even with baggy clothes!
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Nah, not suggesting they wear shorts, just pull the ski pants up like you do when you're are walking in shoes
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