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First Time Skiing - 2 Families

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Hi All

I'm doing a bit of advance planning for the 2020 season and looking for some help narrowing down resorts. We are 2 familes of 4. Kids will be aged 10, 8, 7, 4.5. Me and the other dad have been skiing a few times before, but only to intermediate level. Kids never been skiing before (unless we get them in the Chill Factore beforehand). Wives have 1 week between them. I expect that wives and kids will be in ski school.

Basically we're looking for recommendations on a suitable resort. Given that our wives have not really been (my wife went once to Bulgaria years ago and wasn't impressed enough to want to go again), it's really important they and the kids have a great time so they want to go back (this is a long-term tactical play Very Happy ).

So, we want somewhere fairly pretty, nice cafes and maybe a few shops for the wives to potter around when not skiing (they won't hit the slopes that hard), convenient for ski school / beginner slopes etc and we'd probably be looking for something catered (either chalet or chalet hotel) to make things as easy as possible. Don't need anything too raucous in terms of apres - maybe a couple of bars close to the pistes.

We're not bound too tight in terms of budget.

I've weighed up Belle Plagne with Esprit, but wondered where else people might recommend? If I get this right, I'm sure we'll be skiing every year from here on out. Otherwise it could be quite some time before I get the green light to try again.

Any advice much appreciated.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Saalbach, Meyrhofen, Sauze D'Olx all have the things you're looking for. Personally I'd take them to Sauze.
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Kitzbuehel. It’s a lovely medieval town, not just a resort, so plenty for non-skiers and it's in Austria where you get a great welcome.
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@Pippo9, Welcome to snowHeads! snowHead

I learnt to ski in Austria in a village called Alpbach (voted by the Austrians themselves as the prettiest village in Austria). The nursery slopes are located right in the centre of the village (so they're easy to get to) and once they've progressed beyond that then the skiing is on the nearby Wiedersbergerhorn mountain. Some years ago a lift link was established to the adjacent Wildschonau valley ski area and the whole area is now named the "Ski Juwel" or Ski Jewel, so there's plenty for you two intermediate Dads to explore.

Another good Austrian resort would be Westendorf (again very pretty with nursery slopes close to the centre) or Gordyjh's suggestion of Kitzbühel . As he said, Kitzbühel has a lovely medieval town centre with a pedestrian only main street (and some wonderful cake shops!), you can take a horse drawn carriage ride around the town, and there is an excellent spa/swimming pool complex called the Aquarena (which used to be free entrance with your lift pass but now I think you only get a discounted entrance price). Skiing wise of course there is the full range of ski slopes from nursery up to challenging black runs.

Whether you choose any of these or some other resort, maybe in France or Italy, as a group with first timers I would strongly recommend going with a Tour Operator (TO) this time as they organise all the flights, transfers, lessons and equipment hire. Some TOs have special inclusive good deals for beginners, as it's in the resorts' interest to bring more new people into skiing as an activity. I'd suggest looking at Inghams and TUI (Crystal) and Neilsons for starters anyway.

Good luck with your skiing holiday and hope your wives and kids get bitten by the skiing bug. Your families will thank you! (but your wallets may not Toofy Grin )
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@Pippo9, which week will you be skiing? As that makes a difference to where I suggest.

Having been with Esprit I would highly recommend them as the children will be well looked after and with children their own ages allowing parents to relax after skiing while the children play together in the chalet.

Saying that there place in Belle Plagne this happened less, maybe due to it having a swimming pool?
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Thanks for the replies people. Been browsing the forum for a while and knew I'd get some good tips.

We'd probably be looking at going 29th Feb to 7th March if that helps narrow it down. Possibly 22nd to to 29th Feb.

Never been to any of the Austrian resorts and had thought we might be looking at some of the obvious French choices so good to have a few alternatives to look at.
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Anywhere should be good then, if you were thinking Easter or Christmas then you have to chose much more carefully and with the age of your party that was a possibility.
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@Pippo9, why 2020? What’s wrong with 2019?!

If you chose to DIY (which is dead easy nowadays), put a reminder in your calendar to book flights a year ahead as soon as they are released.
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2019 ain't happening. Youngest will be 3.5 which I think will just be much harder than at 4.5.

Also, already have 2 weeks at Disney booked for April and a boys long weekend to Verbier at the end of Jan.

I'm okay with DIY, but it will just need to feel pretty seamless once we've arrived.

I like the idea of Esprit, although am concerned that the youngest would end up in different evening kids clubs to the rest.

A small catered chalet to ourselves seems ideal, otherwise a half board hotel or chalet hotel. Definitely don't want self catering and paying for meals out every night would soon rack up.
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Try one of the Kinderhotels in Austria?

I have my eye on the Galtenberg in Alpbach, ellmauhof in Saalbach and Hotel bar/Lowe in Sefaus Fiss Ladis for when my boy is 3.5 in 2020 season.

www.kinderhotels.com

They generally have childcare included, on site ski school, very child friendly, indoor pool for the kids etc.
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Hi Pippo, we've done esprit before as well. Most likely you're 4 year old will be so knackered after a day of activities that he/she will be asleep before you have your dinner. The 'baby listening' is brilliant in their hotels. I think they also have a few smaller chalets that you could sole occupy.
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Esprit makes for a fun holiday for kids and a much more relaxing, less challenging one for parents I think.

Their Belle Plagne hotel is very comfortable, well located and there’s plenty of skiing for all levels. However it’s not pretty, or the sort of place that lends itself to cafe culture and shopping when not skiing.

The other issue is that the week you’re planning falls within the French school holiday period. This makes everything much busier and more crowded in France. It’s not Paris week, which is traditionally the most hectic, but would still be busy.

I’d consider Italy or Austria for that week. Esprit has places in Obergurgl and Gressoney, both of which may suit.

Obviously if you don’t want childcare, many other options open up. SnowHeads will have experience of other companies offering childcare if that’s needed.
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Another vote here for Alpbach. We stayed at the Galtenberg, staying with friends on their third trip. We recommended it to other family who are now on their third trip. Many families book for the following year on check out! The pool is perfect for children, and the spa is perfect for the grown ups.
My children learnt to ski in Austria aged 3 and 5, the tuition is great and ski school is next door to the hotel. Highly recommend.
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With so many young children I would try very hard to have ski in ski out accommodation. From experience ski busses just do not work for young children - never mind the crush they will leave gloves, poles etc on the bus.

IMHO Belle Plagne would be an excellent choice, but check the dates you sound as if you are planning to go at half term qnd it could be busy. I am not qualified to comment upon the shopping potential since I hate shopping and avoid it at all cost. However, there are some good things to do if not skiing; for example the olympic bobsleigh track
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Have a look at ski familie & familyski
Think you may need to decide on exactly what you want. I would not rule out srlf catering.
A smaller resort would save a lot in lift pass & a lot of french resorts are either covered by a meals on wheels service or have supermarkets delivery service.
Also uyou would need to distinguish between a village location or mountain location.
Obviously kids mean going half term, so country/travel by air driving becomes s factor.

Kitz was mentioned, but kirchberg in tirol may be more suited. Its the same mountain as kitz. But prob. More family friendly
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
johnE wrote:
With so many young children I would try very hard to have ski in ski out accommodation. From experience ski busses just do not work for young children


That depends on if the kids can ski out though.
Would be a nightmate if its icy out the ski out & your trying to deal with a kid who cant ski, a kid who can & your doing the slips as they run/ski off in different directions Laughing
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We used Esprit for several years when the kids were younger. Like the OP I needed our first trip to be a success to ensure future trips! Initially a bit dubious about the childcare arrangements (especially baby listening and kids separate evening meal) but it really worked for us and our girls absolutely loved the Esprit staff. Our youngest turned 4 on our first trip (Selva). She had no issues and wasn't the youngest there either! Esprit were great. Ski school all Brits or fluent English speaking, with Esprit staff supervising all the time. They got the kids off the slope/fun garden and inside for other activities before any meltdowns!

No experience with them in France (haven't skied there for many years) but we've done Italy (3x Selva and 2 x Gressoney) and Austria (Obergurgl). The people who recommended Esprit to us had been to St Anton (Pepi Gabl) several times with them and raved about it.

Sadly Esprit no longer go to Selva. The hotel in Gressoney La Trinite was great, but ski school and nursery slopes were 10mins away. Esprit had minibuses to take the younger kids, older ones sometimes went with Esprit staff on the service bus. By the time we went our kids were confident red-run skiers. I'm not sure it would have worked so well for us when they were younger and total novices. The Punta Jolanda chairlift is literally 50ft from the hotel but it only accesses red runs so only for more experienced skiers.

Also had a year in Obergurgl in the Alpenblume. Great hotel, 2min walk to the nursery slopes and base lifts etc. We went in Jan though and the weather was awful. It's high and quite exposed so can be cold and prone to poor viz, but again the ski school and Esprit staff were great. Think the ski pass is now joint with Solden.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Agree with the point above about French holidays - if those are the only weeks you can do, I'd avoid France (and I'm a Francophile and get irritated with comments suggesting that it's only in Austria that you'll get a friendly welcome!). With a load of beginners it's not important to have "ski in/ski out" accommodation as they will be able to do neither. What IS important is to have accommodation within really easy reach, on foot as opposed to on skis, of the ski school meeting place (which is also usually where lessons end).
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@Pippo9, I would definitely add Mark Warner holidays to your list, they are are top notch when it comes to kids as well as a bit more upmarket for the adults.
I stayed in their chalet in Tignes a few years ago and I was seriously impressed with the service, the staff, the location, the food in fact everything was perfect. I didn't have my kids with me that time but there were lots of children in the building but oddly you never really saw them due to the kids clubs and listening service. The kids nursery in the building had its own security guards which I thought was impressive. (I wouldn't suggest Tignes by the way for you but definitely look at Mark Warner)

To be honest i'm not sure the resort is key to your success, having been part of a very similar sized(7) first trip with myself and my friend both experienced skiers/boarders and the rest having never set foot on skis before....friends wife and sister and 3 kids 9,7,5. The kids were easy, they went into ski school every morning and then I taught them some more in the afternoons. Friends wife and sister went into ski school every morning too, sister was fine, friends wife was struggling and my friend didn't have the patience so I basically had to tell him to take the rest (who were doing great) and I spent some quality hours with his wife (after getting her down a mountain in tears) building her confidence back up, teaching her to stop at speed etc! By the end of the week we were all coming down in a snake at a nice pace with me at the front and my friend at the back......so we got success (like you said) and they have been every year since (including his wife) So I would say the key to your success is wack the kids in ski school every day (mornings while they are fresh), put the wives in ski school a couple of mornings too, then in the afternoon swap wives and kids (no joke it will work so much better), do that for a few days and then join up, let people retire for the day when they want, offer help and patience, don't show off, stop for drinks, take photos, get a go pro. For it to be that success you want every single person needs to have had a good time, especially the MRS......its not easy but just keep everyone happy all day long! (you can then have a beer once they are all asleep)

Resort wise, never been to La Plagne but should fit your needs Mark Warner do it too: https://www.markwarner.co.uk/family-holidays/ski However its Half Term Sad and I would steer well clear of large mainstream resorts personally as you spend a lot of time queuing and the pistes are crazy busy.

I would go somewhere much smaller off the half term radar, less queuing, less people, less stress. Try somewhere like Chamrousse, Val Cenis, Valmeinier, Val Valmorel I believe you would have a much better family success somewhere smaller and calmer! (and forgot to say with kids you want a short transfer, La Plagne is 2.5-3hrs if your'e lucky!


Hope some of that helps, feel free to ask anything else if you need to Little Angel
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If you are not too bound by budget, as you suggest, then Saas Fee in Switzerland would be the best choice in my mind. It ticks all the boxes:
- Very pretty village
- Excellent nursery slopes, amongst the best and most snow-sure in Europe. They have now installed a moving carpet to access the main nursery slopes which has done away with what used to be the only downside.
- Compact resort ideal for intermediates (impossible to get lost!)
- Lots of easy skiing on the main mountain means most, if not all, of your party will experience true high mountain skiing at some point in the holiday
- Plenty to do in the village in terms of cafes and shops for anyone not skiing
- DIY is easy to organise. You get a swiss transfer ticket for a reasonable cost and then take the train direct from Geneva airport for a very pleasant trip there and back. Much better for kids than being stuck on a transfer bus.
- Great ski schools. The Swiss Ski School has a brilliant program for very young kids there (my four all took there first lessons there). Ski Zenit (which has now merged with Optimum) or Eskimos for the rest.
- Lots of choice of accommodation. I am happy to recommend options if you choose to DIY

I am happy to help with suggestions and information, we have been going there for years and own a chalet there. Although our kids are all quite advanced now, and we mostly ski elsewhere as a result, we still enjoy skiing there every spring when the snow is normally amongst the best in Europe sue to the height. Let me know!

Another option is Obergurgl in Austria which would also tick most of your boxes.
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Belle Plagne ticks most of your boxes except for a near total lack of shops and little scope for wandering around (on foot).
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@Pippo9,
I spent ages looking for a good little resort that fits into the longer term tactical play.

I opted for Zauchensee with Hillwood (family specialist) https://www.familyskiholidays.com/


Great company to ski with, grat resort, excellent ski school, compact village very easy to navigate with all hotels very close to lifts and slopes. The tactical play worked out well, both kids were convinced, and now insist on ski holidays rather than summer hols.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I suspect that finding the right ski school will be more important than finding the right resort. Ideally small groups - not more than 6. That, and having accommodation a very easy walk from the meeting place.
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Albiez-Montrond in France is another great little resort that would suit perfectly.

http://albiez.fr/

It’s very pretty with the ski slopes running out to the junction in the middle of the village. Ski school, plenty of beginner slopes and difficult to get lost. The place is so small that it doesn’t attract those that want to huhne about making for ideal beginner / family skiing.

Limited catered accommodation though and I’m not aware of any TO going there.
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Quote:

Limited catered accommodation though and I’m not aware of any TO going there.

True of all the best small French resorts wink
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Thanks for the recommendations everyone. Really like the look of the Kinderhotels. Saas Fee, Alpbach and Obergurgl look beautiful - albeit I've not yet found what looks like the ideal accommodation.

Looking at dates again, I think 22nd Feb to 29th Feb is most likely - that is half-term for us, although I think most of the UK has half-term the week before. Hopefully that means it will be a bit cheaper than usual for us. We still have the clash with France half-term to deal with which puts me off the big French resorts where the likes of Esprit and Mark Warner seem to focus most of their accommodation.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Alpbach FTW!
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Quote:

We still have the clash with France half-term to deal with which puts me off the big French resorts

If that week turns out to be one of the two Paris weeks it should put you off ALL the French resorts. Smaller ones will be equally crowded but have less capable lift systems (I am speaking from long experience here) Check up for the Fasching holiday in Austria. Having crowded pistes and significant lift queues is a real disadvantage.
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@Pippo9, on the subject of kinderhotels, we went here for our kids first ski holiday. https://www.maerchenhotel.ch/de/Hotel in Braunwald, Switzerland.
From milking the wooden cow to get your milk at breakfast, to using a slide instead of the stairs, to the kids play facilities and the pool it was a real experience for them. Think they enjoyed the skiing too! To get to the slopes there was a horse and cart for the kids! The sledging was fun too.
Not a big resort, but if you think of it as a long term strategy, it should work for you all. snowHead
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Pippo9 wrote:

Looking at dates again, I think 22nd Feb to 29th Feb is most likely - that is half-term for us, although I think most of the UK has half-term the week before. Hopefully that means it will be a bit cheaper than usual for us. We still have the clash with France half-term to deal with which puts me off the big French resorts where the likes of Esprit and Mark Warner seem to focus most of their accommodation.


Pretty sure that's the first week of the Paris Half Term.

Click here for EU-wide holidays
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 Poster: A snowHead
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Also to the OP ... I took my family on our first skiing holiday last year, and i knew it was "make or break" ... get this wrong and we'd not be doing it again. I'd only been once before, for a week about 14 years prior.

I did it all DIY to keep the cost down, but if money will stretch a decent TO could save you hassle. I had to book flights, tranfsers, airbnb accommodation, lift passes, and ski hire all independently. Probably saved myself over £1000 in the process ... but did come with some stress.

For what it's worth my thoughts would be on finding a holiday would be:

1. Flight times. Ideally you don't want to be getting to your resort late in the evening, and/or having to leave very early on day 7. Decent times allow extra skiing!
2. Transfer time. Some people think nothing of a 3 hour+ transfer time - because the skiing will be worth it. In your situation that makes for a long day travelling (with kids).
3. Transfer cost. Private transfer from airport are great - door to door - but could cost 500 EURO for a 2 hour return trip.
4. Accommodation location. Ski in ski out worked brilliantly for us - I would try for this is you can. Walking in ski-boots it tricky for younger kids, never mind they(or you) having to carrying skis and poles as well. Also ... kids get tired and it can be handy to be able to head back to accommodation for a wee break. The alternative is sitting in a bar/restaurant and racking up a bill. Also ... if essential for your kids or you - wifi!
5. Lifts. Tow/drag lifts might be tougher for wives/kids ... so plenty of chair lifts in the resort.
6. Pistes. Plenty of greens and blues. I found that some blues were more like greens, and some more like reds.
7. Lessons. We booked a family group lesson, as we were all pretty much beginners. Obviously we progressed at different paces - and I would say my wife got most "one on one" time ... but it kept us together as a family and we all got to laugh at each other as we fell over. Also meant I could easily gauge everyone's progress and so not recommend anything "too hard" for our afternoons together (when skiing without the instructor).

For what it's worth we went to Avoriaz (just before easter) and loved it. We'd definitely go back ... but we're having to ski at the English and French half term this year, and so we're trying to find somewhere quieter. Avoriaz wasn't busy when we went (apart from a few times during the week where we waited for 5-10 minutes) ... but the last run into the town was pretty busy mid-late afternoon, and it's pretty disconcerting to be traversing slopes side to side (and pretty slowly) with lots of other people going flying past at (what looks like!) break-neck speed. So if your resort will be busy it might be an idea to work out a quieter route back, or to get the lifts down instead.
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Ray Zorro wrote:
@Pippo9, on the subject of kinderhotels, we went here for our kids first ski holiday. https://www.maerchenhotel.ch/de/Hotel in Braunwald, Switzerland.
From milking the wooden cow to get your milk at breakfast, to using a slide instead of the stairs, to the kids play facilities and the pool it was a real experience for them. Think they enjoyed the skiing too! To get to the slopes there was a horse and cart for the kids! The sledging was fun too.
Not a big resort, but if you think of it as a long term strategy, it should work for you all. snowHead


That looks like a bit of a hidden gem for young first time families. How did you get on with the short range of slopes? I suspect it would only be me who's at risk of running out of slopes variety. I can probably live with that as part of the long term play.
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@Pippo9, according to a chart I’ve seen for 2020, the weeks you’re looking at are both school holiday periods for ‘SW & Central France, from the Atlantic coast to the Swiss border’. Zone A as it’s unromantically called.

So not Paris, but still includes some large cities, some of which are relatively close to the mountains. French Alps still busy then.
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@peaky Good spot .. I was looking at 2019 holiday dates :-O
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@Pippo9, I guess it depends on how you are planning to structure the day. For instance, were you looking for all day child-care or were you thinking that you'd do something with the kids outside of lessons?

It was a long time ago that we went (18 years!!) so things are bound to have changed. At that time the hotel did free child care in the mornings, so iirc, most days my wife and I skied in the morning and collected them at lunchtime and took them for afternoon ski lessons.
I was probably similar ski level to what you sound and I don't remember getting bored, but we didn't cover anything like the mileage that I'd do now? The guy that recommended this resort to us was a SCGB rep and he'd been back at least 3 times.

I don't think that there were many shops around, but the hotel was well positioned with fabulous views. The rooftop wellness facility was added after we went, but even then, they had a nice family pool.

It was an ideal mix of quality for the adults, but it was exceptionally child-centred at the same time.

I don't remember there being any other Brits in the hotel the week we were there, so they did the storytelling in English for ours? Having two families would certainly be a better way to go.


There's a youtube video I've found here
http://youtube.com/v/WLz7RYhpI2A it's from 2013 so still not quite current, but it gives an idea on the facilities.
There was a gaming room, soft play area and children's room when we went that I see are still there. The fish tank lift is new, but they did have a v. small petting zoo when we went, that I see is still there now. The outside play area wasn't there in 2000.

Tripadvisor - with photos and reviews here https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_Review-g580344-d637840-Reviews-Maerchenhotel_Bellevue-Braunwald_Canton_of_Glarus.html

We flew into Geneva and then went by train. Braunwald is car-free so if you did hire a car, you'd have to leave it in the car-park at the gondola station.
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Westendorf in Austria is a small pretty village where everything is close by. The nursery slopes are right by the side of the village and there are lots of apartments/b&bs within 2-300yds so you don't have far to lug all the childrens skis. The ski schools are reasonably priced and will take children from age 3 (they will take them younger if they can already ski... thanks Chill factor!). You can fly to Munich (cheaper flights) and hire a car - it's only about a 2hr drive or get the train straight from Munich airport which is easy and only about 2.5hrs (family ticket about 45euros each way). We went when our children were 2, 4 & 6 and tey had the best time! The village and accomodation is very reasonably priced if you book early. For accomodation check this site which has local listings.. (I have no connection just a recommendation I have used it before) https://www.kitzbueheler-alpen.com/en/accommodation/search.html
You can check the map to see exactly how far from the lifts places are Schulgasse is a great location to be on.
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Another recommend for Sauze, it's ideal.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
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1. Zermatt.
2. Courchevel 1850.
3. Kitzbuhel.
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We did three years with Esprit in La Rosiere when our kids were 6 and 10 (now 11 and 15)
Stayed in Chalet Amelia which overlooks one of the the nursery slopes for ski in / out convenience (and the kids can go sledging after the lifts shut). Kids evening club is in chalet next door and you drop young and old ones in just before the adult dinner at 7 ish (kids eat around 5 pm which gives an opportunity to nip out for a quick beer).
The Chalet has a huge south facing terrace outside which the kids can play on / you can have a sit and sunbathe ..
Sleeps 12 in 3 family suites . The suites have 2 bedrooms and 2 bathrooms each.
Communal lounge , dining room .
https://www.espritski.com/ski-chalets/amelia/

La Ros is a pretty little place , and not too busy even in high season.
Several (non rowdy) bars , cafes , restaurants . Enough shops for a potter.
Bowling and ice skating in Lesa Eucherts which is a short walk through a snowy forest path (and can get free ski bus back).

Esprit has its shortcomings - food is only OK and the hotels / chalets themselves are not luxury by any means.
But the kids get really well looked after so makes those first few trips a breeze.

If you go - let me know and I can give you lots of tips .
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
If budget isn't too much of a problem then Lech could be a great choice. Pretty town, perfectly groomed beginner pistes and like many places in Austria the ski school starts around 9:30 or 10am and finishes at around 3pm, allowing you and your friend adequate time to explore an excellent ski area. When my kids were 7 and 4 we went to St Anton which is on the same lift pass but its not so beginner friendly although everyone had a fantastic time regardless. Convince grandparents to come along would be my top tip!
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