 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi guys, new member here, but not to skiing.
After a 10 year hiatus, I'm getting back into the sport and plan on going as hard as I can; I have a 2 week vacation in Aspen Colarado come January, and plan on putting atleast 30 days on the hills per season excluding my vacation(I live close by several decent mountains that have competitive rates and specials).
Before I stopped skiing, I was a decent intermediate. I had no issues parallel skiing or carving, enjoyed fast speeds, and had an aggressive style.
The issue arises from my visit to a local bootfitter last Sunday. Before I went in I did a bit of research in regards to what kind of fit I should aim for, flex, etc. I weigh 240lbs, and am 6 foot 2. My foot is average length(26.5 mondopoint, wear US 10.5 and 11s) and a bit wider than average. When I arrived at the bootfitter, I explained what my goals and concerns were(to get back into skiing and building skill to comfortably ski a black diamond, wanting a more performance oriented boot vs comfort) and he set me up in several models within my price range. Most notable incident was when I tried on atomic hawx 110 and flexed them like jelly. Seeing this, my fitter suggested trying on Tecnica diablo inferno 130s given my weight and leverage. They were difficult to get on, but once in they were very comfortable unlike any other boot and I was able to flex them well. They were on sale at 300$ cad(originally 800) and I caved. I left a happy man.
Over the past few days I have been rethinking my decision however. A lot of people are saying 130 flex is far too much for a person starting after 10 years, how it will shove me in the back seat even if I am generously proportioned and sized. What do you guys think? Was I sold too much boot? Should I bring them back for a softer boot? Or is it worth trying a few times on the slopes? They didn't feel excessively stiff when I tried them again yesterday. 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Do not fixate on flex numbers. The actual fit is much more important. I am 6 foot 3 and 90 kg and ski now Atomic Hawk 130 that were chosen by a good bootfitter, so your flex is +\- right on. I would be worried if your boots are unconfortable and you rather bought a price than perfectly fitting boots ....
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Skarpyona, If your only testing has been at room temperature, you will almost certainly find the boots get stiffer at typical skiing temperatures. Do you have any option to get the boots cold either by leaving them outside overnight or in a freezer for an hour?
As I am sure you will be told, every brands flex number only relates to that manufacturer, so flex numbers from different brands will not be the same. You have almost 100lbs on me, I can flex my 120 flex boots fine.
The other thing to test if you can is to try and the boot clicked into bindings on a ski, as the leverage of the ski makes a massive difference, both in forcing your foot into the skiing position, and the feel of the flex.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Do you wear Spyder clothes? I find them somewhat over aggressive.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Hi guys, thank you all for your feedback!
I understand flex varies from one manufacturer to another. The info I gathered in regards to these boots is they are a 'soft' 130. The fit is fantastic and no doubt proper. When I was younger I do not recall such a tight fit. Getting into them is almost a 2 man job  but once in, they are properly snug, but do not cut circulation.
I can put them in the freezer, and from there, strap into my skis. What kind of movement should I be looking for once strapped in? Whats too little and what is too much? I have a lot to relearn, and even more to learn to get where I want to be.
I do not wear Spyder gear nor am I familiar with them.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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If you are a big and/or powerful guy I wouldn't worry about it. You seem to be Canuckistani so you might have played a lot of hockey.
If you do find the boots too stiff in use there are always tricks good bootfitters (and I contrast here with ski store sales muppets) can do to soften then off by making cuts into the cuff.
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I think those boots have two removable flex adjustment bolts in the spine. If you suspect they are too stiff, try back to back runs with both bolts, one bolt and no bolts.
If you find that you prefer them with less bolts, put the bolts back in, and take them to a boot fitter. The bootfitter will be able to trim away some plastic to soften the flex while maintaining the lateral stiffness and rebound.
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@dave you are bang on the money, east coast Canada(Montreal area to be precise), however I wasn't much of a skater, my dad put me on skis at a young age. That being said I am a former power lifter and have decent legs and core strength. I was thinking of getting the left boot punched to compensate for the different shape of my left foot( the inner section of my foot between my heel and toes gets a pressure in them regardless of skates or ski boots i put on, that being said these boots had the least pronounced pressure in them, rossignols I tried being the worst) after I break them in.
@oceanic you are correct, these boots have two bolts but they strike me as cosmetic, and resemble a circle rather than an Allan key hole. It does however have a spoiler which I believe can be removed to decrease flex. Don't quote me though.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| under a new name wrote: |
| Do you wear Spyder clothes? I find them somewhat over aggressive. |
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@Skarpyona, If you are finding the boots difficult to get into when warm, getting them on when cold maybe a two man operation. In terms of flex it should be a smooth movement which gets progressively harder, but should not hit a brick wall stop.
In terms of movement, I was always told that I should be able to cover the toe of the boot with my knee when looking down vertically.
Back in the late 90's I had Tecnica TNT boots that would be very soft when indoors, but lock almost solid at -10C.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| PowderAdict wrote: |
@Skarpyona, If you are finding the boots difficult to get into when warm, getting them on when cold maybe a two man operation. In terms of flex it should be a smooth movement which gets progressively harder, but should not hit a brick wall stop.
In terms of movement, I was always told that I should be able to cover the toe of the boot with my knee when looking down vertically.
Back in the late 90's I had Tecnica TNT boots that would be very soft when indoors, but lock almost solid at -10C. |
The movement you describe is exactly what I achieve in these boots warm, however I do not recall where my knees reached when flexed. Should this movement be achievable cold? If yes I will toss my boots in the freezer and see what happens tomorrow.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Skarpyona, now that I'm on a proper keyboard...
26.5 MP is apparently a US 8.5. So at least you haven't committed the usual error of buying boots that are too big 
I am no boot expert but if you are a big sort of person a stiffer boot isn't a big deal, IMO. If it feels like you can flex them well, sounds good.
You can always make boots bigger and softer, not the other way around.
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| Skarpyona wrote: |
| PowderAdict wrote: |
@Skarpyona, If you are finding the boots difficult to get into when warm, getting them on when cold maybe a two man operation. In terms of flex it should be a smooth movement which gets progressively harder, but should not hit a brick wall stop.
In terms of movement, I was always told that I should be able to cover the toe of the boot with my knee when looking down vertically.
Back in the late 90's I had Tecnica TNT boots that would be very soft when indoors, but lock almost solid at -10C. |
The movement you describe is exactly what I achieve in these boots warm, however I do not recall where my knees reached when flexed. Should this movement be achievable cold? If yes I will toss my boots in the freezer and see what happens tomorrow. |
You should get the same range of movement when cold, but it will probably require more force to flex the boots. If after being in the freezer they still flex well, you should be fine.
Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much  on Fri 16-09-16 17:37; edited 1 time in total
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You know it makes sense.
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@Skarpyona, there is a bit of a technique to getting boots on. Youtube it and you will get some useful tips.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Hey guys, so heres an update! I put the boots in the freezer, and forgot them there for 2 days! I tried to put them on and nothing. My buddy is a foot size smaller and he couldn't get them on either. I let them thaw for an hour and with a bit of muscle, got them on, strapped myself into the skis and was able to flex them properly( knees met and with a bit of effort past the tip of my boots). I'm guessing if I can flex them in such a state then they are probably going to be fine on the slopes.
In terms of fit they are much tighter, although I am wearing a slightly thicker sock than when I went bootfitting. There is a pressure in both feet now instead of just in my left(due to foot shape). Will this be something a bootfitter can fix(i.e punching them out?). While not cutting off circulation, half an hour in them seems about as much as I would want in them. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Scarpa wrote: |
@Skarpyona, If I leave my race boots in a cold car I can't get them on either (well only after a 10 minute struggle with much pain and swearing). I wear very thin ski socks and find them fine all day, a medium thickness sock just causes pressure points and foot cramps and i could only ski for 2 hrs in them before heading home. Your boot liners will pack down a bit after the first few days, but I would really advise a race spec thin sock.
I have narrow ankles so I get a foam custom liner, on my second now with my piste boots.
Flex is a weird thing, very dependant on your leg structure. I wanted a softer boot for off piste as 130 Redsters were a bit uncomfortable on fat skis in the forests. I tried on a pair of 120 flex Lange fairly technical boots, went to flex them and could nearly bend them double. I then tried a Salomon Quest (Max or Pro) 110 which is meant to be a softer boot and found that with my geometry they were much stiffer. As a back country / touring boot they are very comfy, but I do miss the performance of the stiff boots as I have got into habit of harsh hockey stops on piste, in the softer boots on fat skis I tend to stop then fall over |
Ditto on thje swearing! My buddy was laughing his head off as I struggled to get them on(he is a snowboarder and doesn't understand the struggle).
I removed the spoiler, and the liner and put my foot in the shell. There were small areas(big toe bone) that need to be addressed as even with liner there was contact, and I dont think the plastic will stretch much with a thinner sock, and spoiler removed it went in better. I just finished work and am so very anxious and excited to hit the slopes! I've spent my free time the past few days watching slope runs of whiteface and snowmass, and can't wait for the first snow.
I'm definitely buying a couple of ski socks for optimal fit tomorrow.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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F you've got even remotely big calves chuck the spoilers away for starters.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| F you've got even remotely big calves chuck the spoilers away for starters. |
Done and done! My calves are not Olympian sized but I don't have chicken legs either. The fit is better.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Yeah, I ditched my spoilers for the piste boots, but they have quite a degree of forward lean so even without them they focus you on pressuring the boot.
@Skarpyona, Have fun  I really rate the Falke SK5 ski sock, but there are plenty of thin or ultra thin socks about, the liner keeps your feet warm enough I find.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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[quote="Scarpa"]Yeah, I ditched my spoilers for the piste boots, but they have quite a degree of forward lean so even without them they focus you on pressuring the boot.
@Skarpyona, Have fun I really rate the Falke SK5 ski sock, but there are plenty of thin or ultra thin socks about, the liner keeps your feet warm enough I find.[/ quote]
Thanks for the recommendation, I want the thinnest possible sock and I'm considering a thinner footbed as well, the boots are a very tight, and if I can make it roomier and with better foot support, why not? I don't get very cold in the winter so I am not worried.
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@Skarpyona, I'd wait until you've done a weeks skiing in them before adjusting anything else as the liners packing in from new will make a big difference.
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Saying that I am still using my custom footbeds from 10 years ago and they certainly made a difference to support. A good bootfitter is worth their weight in gold for being able to create a well fitted one.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Skarpyona, Good to hear that the freezer test worked, and you could still flex them when cold (or least when they had warmed a little). At least you will have learned never to leave your new boots outside or in a car overnight 
I have tight fitting foam injected liners, and I find the Falke Energizing socks perfect. They are thin, but not ultra thin, and being light compression, they never get loose or ruck up during the day, even when touring.
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@Skarpyona, when my boots were new and also when I replaced the liners with foamed ones, in both case I thought I was going to have to go home after 20 minutes.
The pain subsided really quickly though...and worst case you'd be astonished how much a boot can be punched out.
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