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The Arlberg Snow Report 2016/2017 (Perfect Blue Sky POWder Saturday!!)

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@Sitter, yeah, Blue 17 and/or 100 down to Flexenbahn cause a bit of an argument over the first dinner before a new piste map was produced to settle it.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
What is a Piste Number?
In nearly 30 seasons i never knew the old system wink

Locsls off Piste routes & secret PP yes Happy
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Dr John,
Aaaaah, you did'nt mention the Seekopf/Zürsersee queues in your first message.
Really sad to read this. It means the masses from St.Anton keep on coming, even deep into low season.

The Lech/Zürs hoteliers aka lift-shareholders need to make up their mind for next season, otherwise it is gonna cost them.
Either a more stringent limitation (in which form?), or even price-differentiation within the Arlberg-skipass.
We are seriously considering skipping Lech for next winter (after 15 years Lech)....Thinking about something Swiss or Dolomites.... rolling eyes
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I'll pass on the numbers, I just go by place names.....
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Dr John wrote:
Need to upgrade Madloch as a matter of urgency (and Zug as a consequence)


They would need to do major piste works, otherwise that run would be mayhem. It can be insane enough, especially on the choke points, with only an old 2-seater dumping people on it.
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@ulmerhutte, speaking for myself, pre-felxen we always wants through Zurs to Lech and only touched the Trittkopf side of Zurs on the way home. The Flexen has made the Zeekoph side easily accessible (and I was loving the slopes and easy inter-piste stuff over there), but even with my untrained eye I could see the added pressure it's putting on Seekoph/Zursersee lifts, and the blues leading down to them from Flexen/Tritt. Was consistently the busiest part of the whole area all week.

They can't upgrade madloch without Zug slope and lift at the same time. That way lays madness.
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@Dr John, Fully agree, re Madloch a larger lift will put massive lift pressure at Zug. Its dead easy really - if you get first lifts up Schindler, over Flexenbahn, down from Trittkopf, up again, over the road, up to Zursersee by 10-10.15 am there's no queues. Leave it until 11.30-12.00 and you are in traffic. If we are doing White Ring (which is rare) we get out and beat the queues. If we got to Zursersee and there were queues we'd head back down via Muggengrat and catch the bus along to Lech, its no big deal.

I think the only thing now about the new Flexen is that previously people who couldn't be bothered catching buses now go over and try the White Ring, clearly it'll be busier, especially midweek and on sunny days, but its dead easy to do a Muggengrat loop and be quickly back up Albona, or we typically go up Albona first, then over Flexen/ Trittkpof/ Zurs/ Muggengrat and are back at Galzig station for 2pm late lunch, you've just got to pick your times I'd suggest, and judge it on the day.
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Markymark29 wrote:
Flexen/ Trittkpof/ Zurs/ Muggengrat and are back at Galzig station for 2pm late lunch


That was my route on 2 days last week, gives a good taste of the area and a feeling of traveling somewhere. If you don't hang about Galzig base to Seekoph/Zursersee lifts is achievable in 30-40 minutes, but you need to time it as you can then hit the first White Ring flocks of sheep 9.30ish. I lapped lapping Hex/Trittkoph if I saw the queues were too big.
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Since none of the lift/piste measures will be in place next winter, and implicite long-term damage is already happening for the Lech-Zürs hoteliers (who are owning the lifts as well), I do expect other less tangible measures to come up, i.e. an extended limitation system (currently only day-trippers are limited for Lech-Zürs-Warth), and/or another pricing-system for skipasses.
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Dr John wrote:
Markymark29 wrote:
Flexen/ Trittkpof/ Zurs/ Muggengrat and are back at Galzig station for 2pm late lunch


That was my route on 2 days last week, gives a good taste of the area and a feeling of traveling somewhere. If you don't hang about Galzig base to Seekoph/Zursersee lifts is achievable in 30-40 minutes, but you need to time it as you can then hit the first White Ring flocks of sheep 9.30ish. I lapped lapping Hex/Trittkoph if I saw the queues were too big.


a LOT of lift-sitting in this tour...not very effective skiing...
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@Langerzug, Lifts come in real handy for rests when you're bashing pow, maybe you slide down the pistes though?! wink
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@Markymark29, You may think so. Reality might be different. We are doing Gasthof Post terrace in between pow. Cool Only slightly better than changing from Trittkopf 1 to Flexen-downhill to Valfagehr (no pow in between there.....)


Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Tue 4-04-17 11:33; edited 1 time in total
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@Langerzug, Laughing Confused
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Zug

There is going to be a new 8 Person Gondola to replace the old 2 person chair

In Planung: Zugerbergbahn
8er Gondelbahn (Ein-Seil-Umlaufbahn)
Länge: 1460 m · Beförderungskapazität/h: 2400
Hersteller: Doppelmayr
Skigebiet: St. Anton/St. Christoph/Stuben/Lech/Zürs/Warth/Schröcken – Ski Arlberg [Lech]
Ersetzter Lift: 2er Sesselbahn fix geklemmt


The Madlochbahn will get upgraded to a 6/8 person chair soon.....maybe even this summer ...
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
KK end of season closing party.

This Saturday April 8th


Griabli

Live This weekend German Rock Covers Band. CRAZY LEO.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Last weekend Longboard Classic party. Stuben.


http://youtube.com/v/zMKRSqIoPSs&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Langerzug wrote:
Since none of the lift/piste measures will be in place next winter, and implicite long-term damage is already happening for the Lech-Zürs hoteliers (who are owning the lifts as well), I do expect other less tangible measures to come up, i.e. an extended limitation system (currently only day-trippers are limited for Lech-Zürs-Warth), and/or another pricing-system for skipasses.


Interestingly, this angle was the subject of much discussion amongst my StA friends. Where does Zurs go from here? What is its brand promise? Great snow to be sure, and plenty of side/off-piste skiing, but that is true of many places. Zurs was however seen as a place to go for the "jet-set", and it cultivated that image by the sort of properties that are to be found there, and the (high) cost of staying and eating there. It was, well, "exclusive". Only the seriously rich could stay there.

I think that image started to tarnish a little sometime in the last 15 years when they appeared to start being happy to accommodate significant numbers of tour buses for day trips. Now? Now, it is like a "truck stop on Interstate 101". Perhaps that is a bit harsh, but you get the drift. Anybody can ski there, and many do (too many?), but equally many more now treat it as a way-point on the transit between StA and Lech/Warth, or vice versa. That was true of us this year - the queues on Seekopfbahn and Zurserseebahn were often too big to stomach.

So, what now? Do nothing, until bookings drop off, and then act? Drop accommodation prices, and effectively become an extension of the St Anton brand (great skiing, can be crowded, but accomodation to suit all tastes). Restrict access and rebuilt that cachet of exclusivity (how?). Be creative and only allow access between certain hours, leaving the pistes for the "locals" first thing in the morning and last thing at night (but they would probably be deserted).
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
It is true that Zürs was not doing so good anymore the last years. Don't think the tourbuses were causing this though. Zürs indeed used to be the very exclusive resort with some very grand luxury hotels, which had grown over the years, starting before WWII. (Zürserhof, Lorünser)
But Lech -the more attractive village anyway- has been developing quickly, and so did some of the Lech hotels. And so Lech has been taking guests from Zürs, were you can get the same skiing, grand luxury hotels plus an attractive village and all that comes with it.
Apart from that some of the grand hotels in Zürs are still holding on to the very old fashioned full-board formula (imagine that!). Rumour has it that this is one of the reasons that the Madlochbahn is not replaced: preventing people to switch over to Oberlech for lunch. (But I think this mostly is just a rumour since natural circumstances at Madloch are the most important factor)

In theory of course the Flexenbahn would raise Zürs (and Stuben) attractiveness, becoming the most central places. But now it looks they have underestimated the effects. And although of course the novelty will wear off, causing less daytrippers to come to the Arlberg to see the new connection; but the recent reports -low season, but still long queues- make me worry.
And it is hard to see the Zürser and Lecher Stammgäste appreciating the new situation...So they need to come up with something. The "extension of St.Anton approach" would not work I think. (as it did not work as Lech-extension, St.Anton also is much nicer than Zürs, and is building more luxury hotels as well).
Another system of daily limitation? But how? A mark-up on the Arlbergskipass for St.Anton-guests wanting to ski in Zürs-Lech? It would be a huge step, but still, I could imagine it happening.

Of course the planned connection to Kappl would also alleviate the situation.
Maybe in 2020 all is fine and season 16/17 forgotten...
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Interesting insights and views, @Langerzug. They certainly gel with me and what I have observed - as a StA skier, doing day visits to Zürs, and beyond.
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Weather coming in.

We will get some dust tonight & tomorrow.

The weekend will be sunny.

Easter weekend maybe change....
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As far as im concerned the more punters going on the ski carpet circus keeps St Anton,Zurs 0ff Piste empty and safe Happy
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Zuers may have been high end but the village is frikkin ugly - it's like being on the moon in the winter and probably the least attractive place in the region in the summer.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@stanton, Since you are virtually coordinating this thread, wouldn't you rather provide some sensible remarks, helping keeping it interesting? Your referrals to carpetskiers come every second day here. Boring!
@Dave of the Marmottes, Zürs never was a real village ("Alpe Zürsch"). It should be compared to a French skistation, it is all purpose build. It is totally closed and deserted in summer. But for Austria it will always be the -real- cradle of alpine skiing, with the first skicourse in 1901, and the first skilift of Austria in 1937...
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Quote:

Zuers may have been high end but the village is frikkin ugly - it's like being on the moon in the winter and probably the least attractive place in the region in the summer.


@Dave of the Marmottes,
Ha, yes. Seems a great shame actually, it could be a great ski destination but seems lifeless, no soul to the village, just a sprawl of bland hotels, pretty unlike the rest of the region. Summer its a ghost-town, all closed up.
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@Langerzug,
Quote:

@stanton, Since you are virtually coordinating this thread, wouldn't you rather provide some sensible remarks, helping keeping it interesting? Your referrals to carpetskiers come every second day here. Boring!

Yes....Does he actually live there though, so does he really know? I guess there's only so much you can put on from looking at webcams and watching social media all day!

How was the Taps race, and/ or which bands are playing in town etc, whats the social stuff going on currently? Which pistes are holding up well, which aren't?
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Fwiw I'm here this week, unbelievably quiet, yesterday we skied to Zurs using the new lifts, no queues and the pistes mainly empty, in fact at times we didn't see anyone else at all! Weather Sunday and Monday was hot, sunny and the pistes pretty slushy but still fun, Tuesday and weds no sun, drizzly rain/snow but pistes in better shape, new snow and lower temps making it much nicer, but it turned really foggy with no visibility, KK not much going on as everyone at Mooserwirt! Great fun great atmosphere, today I'm having the morning off (still carrying an injury from march, not my fault And I've lost my mojo a bit) the others have gone to Stuben and I hope to join in later. Looks like it'll brighten up Friday and Saturday with the plan being going to Lech and Warth. Very Happy


Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Thu 6-04-17 9:30; edited 1 time in total
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@Markymark29, as a regular Arlberg visitor I enjoy his updates on conditions. I do not, however, enjoy his arrogant and dismissive attitude to those he describes as carpet skiers i.e. 90% of the worlds skiing population. Without them there would be no infrastructure or towns for the off-pisters, which decent people fully understand and accept all comers equally. I also think (prepared to be corrected) that he owns property and earns an income from "carpet skier", so he's also insulting his own clients. Not cool.


Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Thu 6-04-17 12:06; edited 1 time in total
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Dr John wrote:
I also think (prepared to be corrected) that he owns property and earns an income from "carpet skier", so he's also insulting his own cents. Not cool.


Hmmm... consensus on this forum seems to be that he drives a taxi, somewhere in Holland, and gets all his updates from trawling the web, and perhaps also making it up at times.

I agree with the rest of your comments. Without piste skiers, none of the wonderful facilities we enjoy today would exist.
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You know it makes sense.
@ulmerhutte, @Dr John, Yep, agree. I enjoy skiing off piste most of the time, but my wife and many friends mostly ski pistes, I enjoy them too....but prefer off piste, for 3 main reasons, no crowds, being in the wilderness, no better ski feeling than untouched powder as you float through it. Was reflecting last night on last season, didn't do enough pow skiing because conditions weren't that great, and in fairness had a bad knee for most of it, but next season is going to be a big one and I'm training hard already, want to shift a couple of stones and be match fit.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
^^^ +1

That's pretty much me too, but I get the impression that @Markymark29 is seriously more useful off-piste than me. Never mind. We both enjoy it, for similar reason, but within the limits of our abilities.
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The funny thing is that "Teppich Fahren" (German for carpet-riding) is a term -probably originated in the Arlberg- referring to groups creating the synchronized first tracks pattern in powder.....😂
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Coming to St Anton next week with a non skier in tow. Does anyone know if you can buy foot passenger/single trip tickets for any of the lifts? I can't see anything on the official lift pass price PDF.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@kerb, yes, you can buy pedestrian day passes
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Thanks @Dr John, didn't want to make any false promises before we get there!
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Rendl Beach and Galzig are one gondola away, & they can go right to the top of Valuga as long as they're not too frighted of heights.
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So this morning was nil visibility glad I stayed in! This afternoon we went to Rendl, nice and sunny and the runs 14 and 15 were really nice and hardly anyone around. 11 was mostly slushy what you'd expect for spring skiing! Taps closing party today/night so we're off to that then tomorrow the plan is to head to Lech as the weather looks hopeful! Forgot to say the lift passes are cheaper now as it's sun weeks snowHead and the shops are full of sales Toofy Grin
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http://youtube.com/v/83DC39auQwE&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Cheers @stanton, that's really helpful.
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New Warth Dorfbahn (Gondola)

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feefee wrote:
So this morning was nil visibility glad I stayed in! This afternoon we went to Rendl, nice and sunny and the runs 14 and 15 were really nice and hardly anyone around. 11 was mostly slushy what you'd expect for spring skiing! Taps closing party today/night so we're off to that then tomorrow the plan is to head to Lech as the weather looks hopeful! Forgot to say the lift passes are cheaper now as it's sun weeks snowHead and the shops are full of sales Toofy Grin


Nil visibility higher up, but clear from Gampen down (odd occasions it did drop just below Gampen). Did make the pistes quieter tho!

They reopened Happy Valley yesterday, tho the only way in is the red. I went down early enough, and although it was icy/hard packed, it wasn't too bad. Looked back as I was heading up Mattun and the carnage had started with people sliding everywhere and a lot busier. Taken some of the strain off Kandahar tho, but quite a few downloading in Galzig at lunchtime, no doubt due to the lack of visibility up there.
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