 Poster: A snowHead
|
Hi all,
Can anyone recommend a good destination for a few days skiing during Christmas this year?
We are ideally looking for a location:
1) Close to either Geneva or Zürich airport (1-1,5 hours drive preferably)
2) Good offpiste opportunities, for a beginner/intermediate offpiste skier
3) English speaking guides/instructors
4) Good atmosphere in town
Looking forward to hear any good exeriences and recommendations
Tina
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
Verbier.
Welcome to snowHeads BTW 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
@TinaSellberg, welome to snowHeads.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
Thanks
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
Les Contamines.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Ischgl, or Arlberg.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'd suggest Les Contamines a little low to guarantee* good off piste at Christmas.
* I'd suggest anywhere a little low to guarantee good off piste at Christmas...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| under a new name wrote: |
I'd suggest Les Contamines a little low to guarantee* good off piste at Christmas.
* I'd suggest anywhere a little low to guarantee good off piste at Christmas... |
The skiing only really starts at Etape at 1470m which is plenty high enough unless it was an extremely poor year. And we just had one of those.
The reason for mentioning Les Contamines is that it's a bit of a snow pocket, has plenty of off piste for those starting out, is 1.5 hour from Geneva and is a pleasant town.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
But @Layne, most of the skiing is below 2,000m. Although it's fair to say that if the snow is (unusually) good, being lower and thus on grassy meadows underneath can be better than higher up where you need more depth to cover the rocks.
A poor start to the season last year is no indicator whatsoever as to how the next season will be...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@under a new name, I'm not sure what you are trying to say tbh. Are you saying it isn't a good recommendation for the OP?
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
@TinaSellberg, St Anton..........there most years end December and I've never been disappointed yet. Only area where could be an issue is Rendl due to rocky terrain but on most grassy slopes even at Christmas there'll be plenty to be had. Meets all your criteria 1-4, albeit distance is nearer 2 hours than 1.5 from Zurich I'd say.
I'll be there anyway so this year will be a good one for sure! 
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
@Layne, just not what springs to mind immediately in the area...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'd probably book last minute (ish) depending on conditions if off piste is a priority, as Christmas is by no means guaranteed for good and safe coverage.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
| musehead wrote: |
| I'd probably book last minute (ish) depending on conditions if off piste is a priority, as Christmas is by no means guaranteed for good and safe coverage. |
Agree with this. Safe Off Piste at Christmas is a bonus in most resorts until the base really builds. I think the Arlberg has as good a chance of anywhere of having suitable coverage.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
| musehead wrote: |
| I'd probably book last minute (ish) depending on conditions if off piste is a priority, as Christmas is by no means guaranteed for good and safe coverage. |
Xmas is not completely high season so you'd be able to find accommodation of some sort.
I'd probably go Verbier or Espace Killy if I absolutely had to book in advance.
It's also not perfect off piste time of year, at all...
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
| downhillalltheway wrote: |
| musehead wrote: |
| I'd probably book last minute (ish) depending on conditions if off piste is a priority, as Christmas is by no means guaranteed for good and safe coverage. |
Agree with this. Safe Off Piste at Christmas is a bonus in most resorts until the base really builds. I think the Arlberg has as good a chance of anywhere of having suitable coverage. |
Really? Since 2008 I haven't had a winter where I haven't been happily skiing offpiste before Christmas. This past season wasn't so good and didn't really get going until the 27th, but even discounting touring after the epic October storm, we still skied powder from the lifts from from mid-Dec onwards.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
| Quote: |
I'd probably book last minute (ish) depending on conditions if off piste is a priority, as Christmas is by no means guaranteed for good and safe coverage.
|
Except if going to St Anton......... I left it too late last year and didn't get in for the first time ever had to stay at home.....booked already for this Christmas/ New Year.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
My recent Christmas trip reports with description of conditions and some photos:
2014 - Tignes
Little or no off piste
2013 - Oz-en-Oisan (ADH)
Mixed bag - some off piste
2012 - Les Contamines
Lots of very good off piste
2011 - Les Coches (Paradiski)
Heaps of snow - fantastic off piste
2010 - Oz-en-Oisan (ADH)
Mixed bag - some off piste
2009 - La Plagne
Mixed bag - some off piste
Bear in mind, I am not doing big stuff, my comments above refer to mellow off piste. But you can read the reports for more detail and some visual evidence.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
Tignes might be safest bet of all but a little more than 1.5 hours from Geneva
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
I had a weekend of offpiste at the Val Thorens opening weekend around 23rd November last year! Lots of lovely snow - but then it deteriorated markedly after we left apparently, and it was pretty poor by xmas.
The point being - it's pretty hard to say what the conditions will actually be like, even in high resorts (yes, Val T is a long way from Geneva too). The year before I did a fair bit of off-piste around xmas and new year in Chamonix, no problem, and a fair bit in Tignes early December. It changes every year though.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Altitude isn't really an issue at Christmas - it's not like you need to preserve snow through warm spring temps at that point. That NW corner of Austria (Arlberg/Ischgl/Vorarlberg) is usually the snowiest part of Europe, and where I'd look to first. Sure it snow's more higher up IN THE SAME PLACE, but going high in a place that gets less snow isn't going to help you until there's enough snow on the ground to be preserved by the altitude (i.e. Easter).
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@clarky999, Yep, Arlberg gets its snow from north-east weather front, Russia etc and dumps as soon as it hits warmer air systems at Arlberg/ Vorarlberg.............bingo, happy days!! Its not about the altitude as you say...............not long now (ish), you about end December for a few turns?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
So much nonsense here about Arlberg!
Arlberg does not get snow from North-East. Arlberg gets snow from West and Northwest. Typically so!
Winds from the east are continental, and thus dry and sunny!
Also the Rendl area is not more rocky than the rest of Arlberg. The truth is that Rendl gets much less snow than rest of Arlberg. Due to the Arlbergmassif blocking the western winds getting to Rendl.
In fact Rendl stays closed often early season for this reason.
As mentioned by others: For Christmas, you should be happy you can ski at all on natural snow. (check the start of the last winterseason december 2014!).
Off-piste during Christmas should be considered a bonus. Anywhere.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
@Langerzug, you're right about where the snow comes from (gotta love that Nordstau!) and about Rendl, but wrong - in my opinion - about skiing offpiste at Christmas. Winter 2014 was exceptionally bad, but if you knew where to go there was still fun to be had in Tirol. I've never yet had a Christmas where I couldn't ski offpiste anyway, and normally do ski offpiste from October onwards - whether that's at Stubai or touring in the resorts before they open. NOT being able to ski offpiste at Christmas would be the exception in my experience, and suggesting you'd be lucky to ski natural onpiste snow ANYWHERE then is laughable.
This October was exceptional (though my legs were too knackered after the first hike of the season to ski it properly):
And the end of Christmas week turned out ok in the end too: http://www.luex.com/magazine/2015/01/12/christmas-powder-skiing-for-the-luex-team
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Damüls gets the most snow in the Alps and its slopes are well suited for beginner off-piste skiers. Moreover, it's all grass there, so you don't need much snow to go off-piste.
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
|
I've skied at that time of year many times and it really is a lottery to be fair. Snowmaking has meant most resorts now off pretty reliable piste skiing but for off piste you really are in the lap of the gods. Even if there is deep snow, the wind and sun can soon put a crust on it. People have mentioned set Anton which has a great snow record but I'm not sure the off piste skiing there is suited to beginner intermediate off piste skiers.
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
| cameronphillips2000 wrote: |
| Even if there is deep snow, the wind and sun can soon put a crust on it. People have mentioned set Anton which has a great snow record but I'm not sure the off piste skiing there is suited to beginner intermediate off piste skiers. |
There's a lot more to enjoyable offpiste than powder - the fact that a wind or sun crust can develop at any point doesn't mean the offpiste is 'unreliable.'
There's plenty of good mellow offpiste in the Arlberg for beginners - far more than most places! It's just that those slopes often get tracked out quickly (less when you head towards Lech/Zürs).
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'm with @clarky999, on this... having no off piste is the exception depending on if you view off piste as purely deep pow.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
@Langerzug, I stand corrected! What I do know is that I've skied every year I've been there at Christmas off piste, and that I've pretty much avoided Rendl (Riffl 2 anyways) to avoid sharks, Maas is usually in great condition as are most grassy slopes.
@clarky999, Agreed, plenty to go at.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
We were in Lech last Christmas, four nights, leaving again on December 25.
The weeks before were very nervous, and we have been thinking of canceling.
Skiing was only on artificial snow, and very limited. Still we a great time with sunshine and the pretty village of Lech even had a very thin, but still, white dusting, creating the perfect Christmas atmosphere.
St.Anton was completely brown in the village, with absolutely no Christmas atmosphere. A remarkable difference between Lech (1430 m.) and St.Anton (1300 m.)
Off piste: Zero zero zero
Snow came on December 25/26.
It is true that is was a very exceptional December for Arlberg.
But it is also fair to say that the weeks before Christmas in several years have been very nervous quite often. Thus my remark: Be glad with a village that has a white Christmas (nothing is more depressing to come from England or Holland (thats me) to find a green/brown village) ,and hope for some off-piste.
In general Arlberg needs at least 100 cm of snow to open marked routes like Schindlerkar and Madloch.
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Fri 14-08-15 16:06; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
|
@Langerzug, That's why I didn't go last Christmas ..... no not really, I left it too late to book and then couldn't get accommodation for a short break, lucky in retrospect. Week 1 February 2015 it was awesome though, as was Wk4 Feb and Wk1 March........it's just weather at the end of the day and you take a chance - we've been 17/18th December in the past and on 15th December slopes have been green, arrived late 16th expecting the worst and skied knee deep powder all weekend on Osthang and Bachseite/ Larches 17/18th. You don't need the big runs to be open to ski powder in Arlberg, that's one of it's advantages, best lift served freeride IMO.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
| Markymark29 wrote: |
@TinaSellberg, St Anton..........there most years end December and I've never been disappointed yet. Only area where could be an issue is Rendl due to rocky terrain but on most grassy slopes even at Christmas there'll be plenty to be had. Meets all your criteria 1-4, albeit distance is nearer 2 hours than 1.5 from Zurich I'd say.
I'll be there anyway so this year will be a good one for sure! |
Definitely St. Anton is good place to go!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
Just to add some advice to the above on this thread... I have been powder hunting early season (Christmas and even early December) for the last few years and have had great powder skiing at all of the places listed below.. though have also had truly awful conditions (in the same week or weekend)! So, flexibility (hire a car) and taking the advice of a local guide is key.
Based on that and what you've said, I would recommend hiring a car from Geneva and being flexible about where you go in the Haute Savoie: Chamonix valley is great of course, but the off-piste can get wind scoured very quickly especially Grand Montets and other high-up bits. Plenty of options within easy drive though even if you stay in Cham (or better Argie), either in Italy through the tunnel (have had awesome conditions at Pila) or down the valley (second the recommendation for Les Contamines - had epic powder skiing here last year while the crowds at the GM were scratching around on wind-pack barely covering the rocks!), but also St Gervais, Megeve etc - all depending on local conditions! For English guides, try googling for Rob Jarvis or Jonny Baird.
Many areas within a few hours drive of Innsbruck also very good for this too, as Clarky says.
Just stay away from my tracks 
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
the obvious answer is being up high (as in altitude) for the offpiste and that makes Chamonix (and close by Courmayeur) as well as Zermatt good choices for early season snow.
anywhere else can be a crap shoot and you just have to get lucky...
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| Quote: |
anywhere else can be a crap shoot
|
@chamo74 that Cham bubble must be nice 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Chamonix at chistmas for offpiste isn't ideal. not unless you bring a big bag full of ptex!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@eddiethebus, agree - and I'm a big fan of Cham!
Offpiste in Cham is very limited around xmas time compared to later in the season - I'd head to Austria myself (albeit I go back to Cham anyway for the parties and friends  )
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
I beg to differ that Cham can be good as anywhere xams time...but hey evryone has an opinion
Zermatt has some fab off-piste - worth the trip to check it out.
- just an fyi as many of you probably know already it was a blazing hot summer and as such the glaciers and neve have suffered tremendously. For many places it will take more than an average autumn snowfall to fill in holes and gaps and cover the billions of boulders....
However lots of forecasts as well as local tales are predicting a better than average winter (who the hell knows...). In any event we are off to a good start and certain places (notably Austria) has had some decent skiing already. This week's forecast looks pretty good too! Fingers crossed.
Francis
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
