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Mini review: Whitedot Ranger Carbonlites

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@stuarth, I think the Brown is referring to the 98 underfoot Ranger. The R.98
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@stuarth, no, Redeemer (non Carbon). I'm sure the CL's are fun, skied the Director CL 15 months ago in Chamonix which is the Redeemer CL's little brother and that was fun so I have no doubt the a Redeemer CL will be good but not skied it. I really do like the WD CL's so light and they just bash on, great skis! Toofy Grin
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Dot. wrote:
@stuarth, I think the Brown is referring to the 98 underfoot Ranger. The R.98


These were limited edition, 12/300 I'm sure they were the wide ones. Maybe it's like that bloody dress, all in the eye..
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Markymark29 wrote:
@clarky999, could have had a go on mine if you'd turned out 2 weeks ago! Laughing wink


Laughing

If you guys didn't have conference calls in the morning I'd have been there NehNeh
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@clarky999, conference calls? Not me!
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@Markymark29, Dan, I think?
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@clarky999, Yeah he came out late on the Thursday morning, I was out early - busy in the pow............. on my holidays not thinking about work! Toofy Grin
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Quote:

@stuarth, the Rag CL3 is a twin rockered ski so the effective length is shorter and it turns very easily and cuts through powder very easily, stable at speed but also floats really well in deep powder. Holds an edge well on pistes, very stable at speed. A much better and lighter ski than the Redeemer, which I skied on for 2 seasons, the Rag is a much more versatile, go anywhere ski. The Ranger is single rockered and skis more like a fat GS ski than the Rag. The Ranger is great in powder too but I would say isn't such a fun ski, and doesn't float as much. I couldn't stop laughing on the Rag. That said it was in deep powder, if the conditions are marginal the Ranger CL would likely revert to my go to ski, but I'd be straight onto the Rags as soon as the powder was deeper. Hope that helps.


Yup, that about sums it up!
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@the_doc,

So when are you bringing/sending me a pair to try out? wink It has finally snowed (up the mountain in Whistler at least)!! snowHead
How would you compare them to a Redeemer CL rather than trad. Redeeemer? For me the CL Redeemer fixed all the minor things I didn't quite like about the Redeemer (which was already pretty good) - better stability at speed, liveliness, reduced weight.
This has been a sorry excuse for a season that hasn't seen them out more than once, but generally I ski them everywhere (except now I also have the Ranger CLs to ski everywhere too wink )

Since I now have (exactly) a Ragnorok hole size in my quiver, am getting tempted.... Madeye-Smiley
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@stuarth happy to bring them along to Whistler, I'll forward you my expense bill, non? snowHead

I'd explain the CL Vs Trad skis from my own personal experience, the CL3 is a damp construction for a carbon ski and makes a massive difference to the feel of the ski. In the Rag its very similar to the Redeemer, the Trad feels very chargey, middle of the road heavy and gives you the confidence that it will take on very different snow conditions with ease. The CL3 is lighter (and feels much lighter under foot), more playful and much easier to tour on.

As for the Redeemer Vs Ragnarok, well the Rags are a much more traditional shape and work better on hard snow, they are also more stable in bigger terrain and have almost as much float. Where the Redeemer really wins is its ability to slash and scrub speed at will in tight spots. Its still the best ski in trees that I've been on.

FYI here's a vid of my first run on the Gen2 Ragnarok Trads in some seriously shallow early season snow.

Freedom Edit from paul jamieson
https://vimeo.com/83526129
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@the_doc,

Might be able to rustle up enough from a whip round to get you an inflatable dinghy or something to paddle here, and a tent to stay in wink If you paddle/hike fast you will probably arrive just in time for the snow (next season) - tempting eh? Madeye-Smiley

I'm all sold on the benefits of CL, and definitely when put with the Redeemers are an awesome combination - the original Rags took some effort to make them go, so just wondering if I need half of Alaska and the skills of Eva to work the new ones. Madeye-Smiley
I absolutely love my CL Redeemers, and am impressed by my CL3 Rangers too so far - though I've not really had chance to really work them over yet with the season we've had. So just pondering if there is a need for the Ragnorok in my ski mix too (well of course there is a need, but you know what I mean! wink)

The Redeemer CL really works for me at Whistler and the N. shore - we rarely have super light fluffy powder but do (normally!) have a whole ton of snow that varies from almost light and fluffy to super heavy porridge, to crust, to crud to all sorts, and open bowls, bumps, drops, through to tight trees - quite often in the space of a one run! An easy going yet stable ski, that has a funky shape that never gets hooked up in weird snow, pivots fast, and has an auto-land works nicely!
Go further into BC and the powder gets lighter, but then unless you are Heli-skiing or hiking somewhere, the good stuff is often in the trees and smaller bowls. snowHead


Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Tue 24-03-15 15:57; edited 6 times in total
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I see that Eva Walkner's just got 2nd place at the FWT2015 Haines event (to secure the overall title even before the final Verbier event) on Ragnaroks Cool
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@spyderjon, you know it makes sense Jon, it's the future! Cool you need a pair for your upcoming trips, maybe borrow Dans when he brings them in for repair/ scrapping?! Your BSL is same!.....he'll never know wink
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Markymark29 wrote:
@spyderjon, you know it makes sense Jon, it's the future! Cool you need a pair for your upcoming trips, maybe borrow Dans when he brings them in for repair/ scrapping?! Your BSL is same!.....he'll never know wink

I mounted mine up yesterday Cool.

Just deciding on whether to cut skins for 'em or use splits.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Quote:

the original Rags took some effort to make them go, so just wondering if I need half of Alaska and the skills of Eva to work the new ones


The new Rags are mountains apart from the originals to be honest! They're playful yet serious, pretty easy to ski with and fantastic in pow. They've still got some of the guts of the originals but when we sat down with Fred we both wanted more powder performance in a more usable package. Job done I think Wink
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
stuarth wrote:

...and am impressed by my CL3 Rangers too so far - though I've not really had chance to really work them over yet with the season we've had....



Can finally confirm the CL3 Rangers work just fine for me in the powder too! snowHead snowHead
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@stuarth, I'll be on some tomorrow Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
OK so I now have a few days on my 186 ranger carbonlites so thought it might be worth posting some thoughts.

Context: I'm level 10/11 on the inside out scale. Enjoy all sorts of skiing both on and off piste but don't get that much chance to ski deep powder (ski in Europe!) or anything over 45 degrees. I skied these with Beast 14s and mid weight touring boots (albeit stiffened with intuition powerwrap liners). The white dots are my first skis with any kind of rocker or unconventional side cut so I can't really compare them to similar skis. Conditions were varied - most things except real hard pack and deep powder but including slush, excellent packed powder, wet fresh snow, and a little powder upto boot depth.

My first reaction was how different they were to my current skis (stockli stormrider xl 174 and line prophet 100 at 179) which both have conventional sidecut, 18m radius and similar effective edge albeit different widths (75 and 100 underfoot). The rangers have similar effective edge but a big tip rocker and less shape (28m radius) plus 107 underfoot. Perhaps most significantly they have a MUCH straighter tail.

This really showed up the first time I rolled them from edge to edge (red run, firmish). I tipped them over quickly as I would on my other skis and the edges just didn't take. I found I had to be much more patient with the transition and they would pick up the new edge. Reading back I think Rob reported the same thing. I realise now that my default turn on piste involves cranking up the angulation through the turn then using the pressure built up to transition into the next turn. This didn't work so well on the rangers. I found there was a limit to the angulation I could achieve before the edges would break away. Not a problem I've experienced on the lines or stocklis. The consequence of having to be more patient at the start and less aggressive at the end was that I had a more limited range of turn shapes and less ability to control speed through gravity.

Much of the above is a bit unfair. I didn't buy them as a piste ski and didn't expect them to carve brilliantly. They manage fine. Under softish conditions I wouldn't care. In hard conditions I'd be misty eyed for the stocklis.

Now the good stuff:
First, they are nice and light but don't seem to have the downsides of light skis. I was skiing them with tech bindings and lightish AT boots. I expected them to be a bit flappy and chattery when it got choppy but not really. In true crud they do get deflected more than something with a chunky wood core with a layer and a half of titinal but it's not by much. I think that is seriously impressive.

Second, although they are quite a bit longer than my other skis is found them very nimble in short (pivoted / swing) turns. Actually more so than the Lines. In boot depth or deeper the full shaped tails of the stocklis and lines can grip a bit too hard at the end of the turn if you are making powerful turns. You can get tripped up by your weight moving over before the tails are ready to let go. The Rangers seem to drift and slide smoothly and predictably. It inspires confidence and is rather flattering. It allows you to go for it that bit more.

The tip rocker seemed to remove all worries of top dive.

All in all I'm delighted. I feel I could happily ski these anywhere off piste and enjoy them on piste in soft conditions. Just what I was looking for. Personally I would still want to supplement them with something that could give a more "technical" ski on hard pistes but not everyone will care about that.

Thanks again to everyone here who offered advice and Jon for supplying them and for words of wisdom on the phone.
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OK so I now have a few days on my 186 ranger carbonlites so thought it might be worth posting some thoughts.

Context: I'm level 10/11 on the inside out scale. Enjoy all sorts of skiing both on and off piste but don't get that much chance to ski deep powder (ski in Europe!) or anything over 45 degrees. I skied these with Beast 14s and mid weight touring boots (albeit stiffened with intuition powerwrap liners). The white dots are my first skis with any kind of rocker or unconventional side cut so I can't really compare them to similar skis. Conditions were varied - most things except real hard pack and deep powder but including slush, excellent packed powder, wet fresh snow, and a little powder upto boot depth.

My first reaction was how different they were to my current skis (stockli stormrider xl 174 and line prophet 100 at 179) which both have conventional sidecut, 18m radius and similar effective edge albeit different widths (75 and 100 underfoot). The rangers have similar effective edge but a big tip rocker and less shape (28m radius) plus 107 underfoot. Perhaps most significantly they have a MUCH straighter tail.

This really showed up the first time I rolled them from edge to edge (red run, firmish). I tipped them over quickly as I would on my other skis and the edges just didn't take. I found I had to be much more patient with the transition and they would pick up the new edge. Reading back I think Rob reported the same thing. I realise now that my default turn on piste involves cranking up the angulation through the turn then using the pressure built up to transition into the next turn. This didn't work so well on the rangers. I found there was a limit to the angulation I could achieve before the edges would break away. Not a problem I've experienced on the lines or stocklis. The consequence of having to be more patient at the start and less aggressive at the end was that I had a more limited range of turn shapes and less ability to control speed through gravity.

Much of the above is a bit unfair. I didn't buy them as a piste ski and didn't expect them to carve brilliantly. They manage fine. Under softish conditions I wouldn't care. In hard conditions I'd be misty eyed for the stocklis.

Now the good stuff:
First, they are nice and light but don't seem to have the downsides of light skis. I was skiing them with tech bindings and lightish AT boots. I expected them to be a bit flappy and chattery when it got choppy but not really. In true crud they do get deflected more than something with a chunky wood core with a layer and a half of titinal but it's not by much. I think that is seriously impressive.

Second, although they are quite a bit longer than my other skis is found them very nimble in short (pivoted / swing) turns. Actually more so than the Lines. In boot depth or deeper the full shaped tails of the stocklis and lines can grip a bit too hard at the end of the turn if you are making powerful turns. You can get tripped up by your weight moving over before the tails are ready to let go. The Rangers seem to drift and slide smoothly and predictably. It inspires confidence and is rather flattering. It allows you to go for it that bit more.

The tip rocker seemed to remove all worries of top dive.

All in all I'm delighted. I feel I could happily ski these anywhere off piste and enjoy them on piste in soft conditions. Just what I was looking for. Personally I would still want to supplement them with something that could give a more "technical" ski on hard pistes but not everyone will care about that.

Thanks again to everyone here who offered advice and Jon for supplying them and for words of wisdom on the phone.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@jedster, I've not skied mine on many hard pack pistes and in all honesty don't go looking for it, all I can say on that is that they clearly won't perform as well as a thoroughbred piste carver in those conditions but are in their element in full powder and boot high on piste powder. I've skied them on icy moguls and they turn really well, I've got these as my go-to ski with Rag CL's as a big powder day ski. I'm certainly in no dash for a piste ski, happy that the Ranger CL's will get me down the steepest black.
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@jedster,
That is pretty much my thoughts too.
Had some proper snow to try them out in again this weekend and had a blast, bit of jumping, a bit of hiking (I forgot to bring my skins with me! Embarassed ), steep and deep untracked pow (pretty much first tracks into West cirque and west bowl on a powder day! snowHead ), general hooning around...

The stand-out thing for me also is that they ski chopped up stuff and landings like a big tank of a ski, but you don't pay for it in nimbleness and general heft, the damping and stiffness is absolutely bang on. The other standout thing for me is like the Redeemers (almost) the ability to deal well with a wide range of snow conditions - a really important feature for a ski on the West/Wet Coast.
Also agree your point on carving them, though was sort of wondering if it was me getting too used to skiing fully rockered skis and being a bit lazy Madeye-Smiley I find that if I work a bit to engage the tips sooner they carve reasonably on hard snow.

They are a bit more effort to ski than my Redeemer CLs, particularly in tight spots, but I'm actually quite liking that (apart from the tight spot bit!), and it's now a bit of a dilemma as to which skis to take (Rangers only take my touring boots so have to pre-decide!). I would probably still take the Redeemers if the snow was really funky, or I was going to ski a lot of trees (no chance of that this year!)... or my old Mantra rock skis if it is mostly an on-piste/rocks/mud day... or GS skis if only a piste day.... So if the Rag CL3s work out for me too, I'm never going to get out the house in the morning!! wink snowHead
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
stuarth wrote:


They are a bit more effort to ski than my Redeemer CLs, particularly in tight spots, but I'm actually quite liking that (apart from the tight spot bit!), and it's now a bit of a dilemma as to which skis to take (Rangers only take my touring boots so have to pre-decide!). I would probably still take the Redeemers if the snow was really funky, or I was going to ski a lot of trees (no chance of that this year!)... or my old Mantra rock skis if it is mostly an on-piste/rocks/mud day... or GS skis if only a piste day.... So if the Rag CL3s work out for me too, I'm never going to get out the house in the morning!! wink snowHead


Ha ha - full tail catches us lazy drift n lock skiers out. Think I'm still sold on the fun factor of a rockered tail .
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@stuarth, Laughing
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Quote:

Ha ha - full tail catches us lazy drift n lock skiers out. Think I'm still sold on the fun factor of a rockered tail .




Very Happy

Must admit that I'm intrigued now by a full rocker. I found the straightish tails of the Rangers so user friendly off-piste compared to a full shaped tail that I wonder what I would be gaining. But more is more Very Happy

Quote:

I find that if I work a bit to engage the tips sooner they carve reasonably on hard snow.


Agree - its not that they won't carve its just the range of shapes and slickness of the transitions. Like I say - certainly not disappointed by how they perform on piste just thought my experience might be interesting to other people coming from a more conventional sidecut
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